Timestamp Speaker Transcript
00:00:00.90 Tony Fowler And we're rolling.
00:00:03.37 Taylor Kruse Hey welcome back to the Cruise Elite Podcast. What's up Tony?
00:00:06.99 Tony Fowler Good morning Taylor and good morning Alicia.
00:00:08.98 Taylor Kruse What? How are you doing?
00:00:10.15 Tony Fowler Welcome back.
00:00:11.22 Taylor Kruse We've got the CEO with us. hey
00:00:15.76 Tony Fowler The bus is in the building.
00:00:17.90 Taylor Kruse Yes. our daughter is in kindergarten so Our schedule is freeing up just a little.
00:00:21.52 Tony Fowler Wow. Wow. Congratulations. Or what what do you say about that? I don't know.
00:00:28.87 Taylor Kruse This has been a hard transition so we're not totally settled yet. She has not been wanting to go.
00:00:32.17 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:00:34.02 Taylor Kruse Yeah we weren't we weren't sure if this...
00:00:33.85 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:00:35.52 Taylor Kruse was gonna work out but it did. so This morning she said she said she was not going to school. so
00:00:40.85 Tony Fowler Hmm. Um...
00:00:42.50 Taylor Kruse She's there.
00:00:43.42 Tony Fowler She's going to make a friend. really soon and then she's gonna love it and she'll be so excited Bye. I bet.
00:00:48.83 Taylor Kruse Yeah she's... yeah she's she's doing all right now she's she knows a lot of the the other kids it's just that it's like it's she was there for preschool and but there's like certain things that are just a little different
00:01:01.48 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:01:01.51 Taylor Kruse and then they do have one new teacher so that was like enough of a change i think to Make it seem. I don't know a little New compared to before so but she seems to be settling now
00:01:11.76 Tony Fowler Yeah. Do you guys have any memories from that? time in your life.
00:01:18.48 Taylor Kruse I remember kindergarten and I remember. Being okay but other kids crying and being confused about why they were so upset.
00:01:25.44 Tony Fowler yeah
00:01:26.19 Taylor Kruse I don't i don't have any of those memories really.
00:01:29.03 Tony Fowler This is bringing bringing something back for me.
00:01:29.26 Taylor Kruse and
00:01:31.16 Tony Fowler I remember... Specifically kindergarten being like... intimidating. Because like...
00:01:36.40 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:01:37.49 Tony Fowler People were learning to read. And like... they were just all these like rules and structures that I wasn't used to. and
00:01:45.62 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:01:46.16 Tony Fowler Um you know it's a big change for for a kid.
00:01:48.55 Taylor Kruse Yeah. For sure.
00:01:52.31 Tony Fowler Yeah. Um So I imagine there'll be a portion of your mind that will be on her. during this episode. Um But we've got something kind of.
00:02:03.58 Tony Fowler kind of fun and... and Um I think... i think An easy lift. So that. you know that... that 25 % of your mind that's on her.
00:02:17.51 Tony Fowler won't be won't be taxed.
00:02:19.66 Taylor Kruse Easy is good. Easy is good right now. Yeah it's been busy. Gosh. We started the neuro dojo too. So and it's we're adding a lot of like upgrades to it. So it's just a huge amount of work right now.
00:02:29.86 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:02:31.58 Taylor Kruse So.
00:02:32.17 Tony Fowler Interesting.
00:02:33.34 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:02:33.42 Tony Fowler what what uh what kind of upgrades are we talking about here?
00:02:37.48 Taylor Kruse So we're turning the course into modules instead of before we had it organized it's just the weekly replays come out once we finish them. And now when we load the replay we're creating a module for it that has tutorials that come with it to so that people can access the exercises that we teach without having to watch the full replay.
00:02:56.23 Tony Fowler mm-hmm
00:02:57.31 Taylor Kruse Yeah and it's cool because now we've been We're able to do something we've been talking about for a while where we can create some companion videos to go with. the live call that's recorded.
00:03:09.09 Taylor Kruse And what I mean by that is... were able to show more creativity and drill selection based off of the theory that they get during the live call.
00:03:20.67 Taylor Kruse Because we we talk a lot of theory and we demonstrate. certain basic drills. But then... we sort of expect that people Use the theory to figure out lots of different kinds of drills that they can do. And it's a big expectation and it takes...
00:03:39.17 Taylor Kruse It takes time and it takes practice to be able to do that.
00:03:41.26 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:03:43.01 Taylor Kruse and kind of putting myself in their shoes because I was in their shoes a long time ago I always wanted a visual for... what that type of Creativity.
00:03:53.40 Taylor Kruse really was? And so now we're creating these companion videos that show like okay here's. Here's how you take one of our basic mobility and motor control drills. And we changed some things about it.
00:04:05.94 Taylor Kruse to make it more targeted to the cerebellum to...
00:04:08.52 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:04:08.85 Taylor Kruse to use some of these things we talk about in the theory where we want to add more accuracy challenges or add more rhythm challenges or... add a resistance band or perturbation. and in So it's pretty cool. And so far the feedback has been.
00:04:26.02 Taylor Kruse really positive. I think that the... the students are really liking the layout and then seeing those videos.
00:04:32.17 Tony Fowler Yeah that's awesome. That's awesome. So the the value continues to grow.
00:04:36.88 Taylor Kruse It does doesn't it?
00:04:37.12 Tony Fowler It's becoming more and more structured. and
00:04:40.17 Taylor Kruse That's right. Yeah and they're in...
00:04:41.05 Tony Fowler You're figuring out better ways to. present the information right?
00:04:44.74 Taylor Kruse exactly yeah and the the community is the they're the ones that are helping us figure out how to do this you know based on where they are with learning the material and applying the material so it does mean a lot of filming And editing. And editing to come. but
00:05:00.97 Tony Fowler Your favorite.
00:05:02.02 Taylor Kruse Okay. Yeah we just did a solid batch this summer of... you know drills and different you know categories of of training and those have all been uh
00:05:13.12 Taylor Kruse you know uploaded and you know edited and stuff but you know they'll be There'll be more to do for sure but... it's coming together
00:05:21.15 Tony Fowler Yeah. That's awesome. As someone that engages almost entirely through just this podcast right? Um That. Sounds super useful.
00:05:32.63 Tony Fowler in terms of getting more. uh kind of like hands-on scenarios where it's like okay well how do we actually apply this stuff
00:05:41.02 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:05:40.92 Tony Fowler because it's one thing for us to talk about it here and it's another thing to actually go through the motions and be like how can we improve this specific drill for this specific
00:05:50.34 Taylor Kruse Right.
00:05:50.55 Tony Fowler reason you know
00:05:51.62 Taylor Kruse Right. Yeah. And in speaking of that we we've also added a ah really neat feature to to our membership platform. where we're doing like mini sessions with some of the students and then and Everybody else can shadow.
00:06:05.48 Taylor Kruse So yeah that's yeah that's been neat too.
00:06:05.73 Tony Fowler That's awesome.
00:06:07.52 Taylor Kruse So then they can see some of it in action and they can kind of see my process. and I can kind of play several roles where I'm... I'm the coach. But then I also kind of pause and...
00:06:18.99 Taylor Kruse address things with the students like hey did you guys notice this you know so that they can again get a visual.
00:06:26.13 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:06:26.20 Taylor Kruse And. You know not necessarily. copy what i'm doing but use it as like their confidence for a little bit until they can start branching out and figuring out ultimately what their process is with a person.
00:06:40.25 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:06:40.16 Taylor Kruse It's cool for learning how to make decisions in real time. That's what we always wanted when we were first learning applied neuro. So they can actually see Taylor make a decision based on an assessment. a the evaluation of the history. and um Mm hmm.
00:06:56.92 Tony Fowler That's so cool That is so cool. So you guys have been really busy. It hasn't just all been camping and...
00:07:03.96 Taylor Kruse No.
00:07:04.41 Tony Fowler And fishing huh?
00:07:06.21 Taylor Kruse no no it hasn't what we've done a lot of camping this summer which is cool i mean this is the most yeah the most uh free I don't know what to call it. Um It actually is the most downtime we've ever had in the summertime.
00:07:18.47 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:07:19.36 Taylor Kruse Yeah but it just made it extra hard when we have to get back in the groove. Well it's more challenging to in our daughter's home because we have to parent and work at the same time. So we might be getting the same amount of work done now but.
00:07:26.71 Tony Fowler mm-hmm
00:07:29.34 Taylor Kruse we get it done faster.
00:07:31.01 Tony Fowler Right.
00:07:31.88 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:07:34.42 Tony Fowler Um Well good timing for kindergarten then in terms of.
00:07:39.08 Taylor Kruse It does help.
00:07:38.99 Tony Fowler the dirt the dojo and and everything.
00:07:40.86 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Mm hmm.
00:07:43.84 Tony Fowler Awesome. Awesome. Well. We've got ah I think it's a fun episode today. um about our high payoff drills. And...
00:07:55.10 Tony Fowler Throughout the podcast we've talked about high payoff drills. Taylor you've mentioned a couple of yours. um But I thought it would be a good idea to talk about. um R.
00:08:07.24 Tony Fowler the three of us are specific high payoff trolls.
00:08:10.73 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:08:11.06 Tony Fowler And give the listeners kind of an idea of. how that works what that actually looks like. how we use them and how... they might be the same or different.
00:08:21.84 Tony Fowler across. three different individuals right?
00:08:24.46 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:08:25.23 Tony Fowler Um So to get us started... I think it's important to... Just define again what a high payoff drill. actually is.
00:08:36.31 Tony Fowler um And to give a little context to the question. you know There are certain things that I do sometimes that just feel good. And I like them. ah But... you know I might...
00:08:47.51 Tony Fowler Have some some knee pain or some tightness in my leg And they don't really do anything for that. Um and so you know Is this drill that I do that makes me feel good a high payoff drill?
00:09:02.11 Tony Fowler Or is it just something that I like you know? And so I think this is a this is.
00:09:04.18 Taylor Kruse Sure.
00:09:05.94 Tony Fowler you know something that we can talk about right?
00:09:09.23 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:09:09.20 Tony Fowler So yeah I'll pass it over to you.
00:09:11.64 Taylor Kruse Okay so... Keeping it. Pretty basic. Um It really comes back to the threat bucket concept. All right so...
00:09:22.98 Taylor Kruse We can use the threat bucket. in like we can look at the threat bucket in a number of different ways When it comes to assessing drills to find a high payoff drill
00:09:34.24 Taylor Kruse A high payoff drill in my mind is one that immediately... reduces perceived threat. for the brain and nervous system. And...
00:09:45.99 Taylor Kruse When? that happens. Generally what you see... is a result. a positive result. with whatever type of assessment you are using.
00:09:58.76 Taylor Kruse that's going to tell you is this better same or worse? Okay so...
00:10:05.77 Taylor Kruse basically like at the very beginning point of starting to get people into applied neuroscience and training we always teach. basic range of motion testing.
00:10:17.91 Taylor Kruse So we've talked about it on the podcast before. um This is something that we teach also in our free masterclass to get people started with an assessment process. And it is simply.
00:10:28.47 Taylor Kruse testing any range of motion and we give you... certain ones that seem to be high percentage for people to use. It could be a forward bend. It could be a backward bend. It could be trunk rotation.
00:10:42.16 Taylor Kruse It could be shoulder flexion. Shoulder internal rotation. There's There's five or six of them that people... usually explore until they find one or two of those ranges of motion.
00:10:53.81 Taylor Kruse that very clearly... Tell them. Better same or worse after any training input. And an input in this case would be the exercise. So...
00:11:04.19 Taylor Kruse When you perform an exercise And there is... Um a high payoff result. generally what that means is that range of motion is Improving.
00:11:16.14 Taylor Kruse So if I bent over... to touch my toes with that forward bend assessment. as my bass line. and my fingertips were only let's say mid shin and i was feeling pretty tight in my low back or hamstrings And then I applied. In exercise
00:11:32.41 Taylor Kruse I would immediately retest. And if I... went further on my range of motion assessment. then I would say okay that's a high payoff drill. Right. I improved. right My performance was was better.
00:11:46.58 Taylor Kruse And maybe I feel less. Tension. in my low back. So very at a very basic level that's what we're calling a high payoff exercise. And it also could be one that decreases tension or pain. And oftentimes what's neat about this.
00:12:01.46 Taylor Kruse is that it does. So anytime you find a high payoff. drill typically what we experience is that the results echo through the body. in some way And what that means is that range of motion improved.
00:12:15.36 Taylor Kruse And you experienced that. But if you were to also test... balance. or stability. or strength or... how much pain you're experiencing or.
00:12:26.25 Taylor Kruse tension in the knee tension in the back whatever you're... Main complaint is. Generally speaking a very high payoff drill will improve all of those things to some degree.
00:12:37.16 Taylor Kruse And so that's what we mean by echoing through the body which is kind of cool. Yeah and like you said you don't know if if a drill that feels good is actually giving you that kind of response. And so having the assessment can be like a... reliable feedback tool.
00:12:53.69 Taylor Kruse to know because you can do drills that feel good that don't actually assess well. Yeah that's...
00:12:59.26 Tony Fowler Yeah
00:13:00.87 Taylor Kruse That's very true
00:13:02.53 Tony Fowler So with with range of motion With a high payoff drill is it always going to improve? range of motion specifically. Uh oh. Sorry I just lost you guys for a second.
00:13:15.49 Taylor Kruse Yeah that was weird. yeah
00:13:16.93 Tony Fowler Oh okay. We're back. um Is it always going to improve range of motion specifically? um Or is there a scenario where... Range of motion might not be touched but...
00:13:28.62 Tony Fowler your... Shoulder tension. goes away.
00:13:32.95 Taylor Kruse Yeah. there
00:13:33.27 Tony Fowler um Or.
00:13:33.95 Taylor Kruse that mm-hmm
00:13:34.76 Tony Fowler Yeah go ahead.
00:13:35.54 Taylor Kruse yeah It can happen. It can happen. Again usually... you're going to see an improvement in several different qualities If it's really. high enough payoff for what we're actually looking for.
00:13:48.52 Taylor Kruse If you're not getting an improvement it's possible there's a system involved in the assessment that is under threat during the assessment. So an example would be during a forward bend or during like trunk rotations your head is moving through space.
00:14:02.70 Taylor Kruse And so people who have high threat with their vestibular system might actually get it regressed.
00:14:04.01 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:14:07.82 Taylor Kruse assessment but we don't know if it's from the vestibular input during the assessment or if it was from the drill that they just did. Yeah this is an important... thing for people to learn.
00:14:20.06 Taylor Kruse Even you know any coach that's applying this. kind of material with with clients but really for anyone who's exploring. drills and looking for high payoffs. In fact yesterday I was doing one of these mini sessions with one of our students.
00:14:34.59 Taylor Kruse with you know but where everybody was shadowing. And we had this exact thing happening. where the person I was working with had a very sensitive nervous system.
00:14:45.57 Taylor Kruse And they had. a very significant sensory mismatch. where Basically they were overstimulated from vision and vestibular input. This is something that she described as...
00:14:58.40 Taylor Kruse her negative symptoms having had a concussion at one point. And she never really fully recovered. from that so What would happen to her? is we started using...
00:15:12.34 Taylor Kruse um balance. as her main assessment because that was actually one of her main goals is she wanted to feel more stable because She's really struggling with balance. The trouble was... every single time we went to test her balance Even if she just had to move three feet. through the room to set herself in the correct position where we could see her on camera.
00:15:34.13 Taylor Kruse That's that. sensory mismatch that she was having. would kind of... skew all her Assessments And she would always assess. poorly. Because... even though she had applied the drill.
00:15:48.09 Taylor Kruse There was too much time in between applying the drill in running the assessment and there was too much movement in between. So it became challenging. to accurately understand what was happening.
00:15:59.74 Taylor Kruse So eventually we. We caught on to this. And then we started running some different assessments for her. We started running coordination assessments in a seated position.
00:16:09.36 Tony Fowler who
00:16:09.72 Taylor Kruse where she was doing what we call cerebellar rams. which are essentially fast. movements in this case um With her with her upper body to tell us like what was happening with her cerebellum. as a result of whatever training input we used.
00:16:25.51 Taylor Kruse And this was now useful for us because I wasn't having her stand up. I wasn't having her. Move the chair get in position. And we could accurately see okay this is a high payoff drill for you.
00:16:37.37 Taylor Kruse It is targeting the system that we're trying to improve here. So it can be sensitive sometimes depending on the situation
00:16:49.10 Tony Fowler this uh brings to my mind the the table dilemma. that we talk about so often.
00:16:55.10 Taylor Kruse All right.
00:16:55.59 Tony Fowler Um... Because you know in terms of feeling good and whatnot you know a lot of a lot of people myself included. might enjoy a massage where we're lying down.
00:17:05.59 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:17:06.32 Tony Fowler And... feel like you're really getting those knots worked out. And... Um... You know you you you're you're looser you're you're less tense right?
00:17:18.48 Tony Fowler Um...
00:17:18.22 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:17:19.100 Tony Fowler But you're in a lying down position. And so someone that might have a vestibular. Issue. You know might might see that Uh improvement fall apart as they get up and walk away from the table.
00:17:34.74 Tony Fowler Right.
00:17:34.60 Taylor Kruse Yeah that's that's the elephant in the room with manual therapy. that That is like... I mean manual therapy is a really powerful tool. and it's it's excellent when it's applied correctly but yeah the the fact is The body that's being worked on.
00:17:52.29 Taylor Kruse in a horizontal position is It's a totally different nervous system as soon as they're standing up. All right and that's why so many people walk off their results so quickly
00:18:01.75 Tony Fowler Do you find his... interestingly you you said seated do you find that that's like a nice In between. Um... where you can...
00:18:10.06 Taylor Kruse I always go standing if I'm doing anything.
00:18:11.61 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:18:12.20 Taylor Kruse Yeah I try to. So. Well let me put it to you this way. It's not entirely true Laying down is still. Valid. And sometimes it's an entry point. Because sometimes a person needs to be... supported relaxed.
00:18:27.51 Taylor Kruse Right. and that's perfectly fine. but typically What you see is that... When you can start to... If you're using manual work in some way if you can start to get them to a vertical position.
00:18:41.47 Taylor Kruse For applying the manual work and that could be seated like you said I like to get to standing. Because... It's where if you think about it. from kind of a said principle.
00:18:53.76 Taylor Kruse Standpoint where you know we we want all systems integrating together. Right? And. The best place to do that is standing.
00:19:04.72 Taylor Kruse all right and we want We want the individual to function well with less pain. in a standing position because they're going to be spending so much time in that position So to make the manual inputs more specific eventually...
00:19:20.27 Taylor Kruse Getting to that vertical. position can be quite useful.
00:19:24.03 Tony Fowler here
00:19:29.43 Tony Fowler So... We could do a whole episode on this and I think we might have already. um But how might you... start trying to find your high payoff.
00:19:40.24 Tony Fowler Drills.
00:19:43.16 Taylor Kruse So for me it's still the basics right? I still use... I still use range of motion testing.
00:19:49.45 Tony Fowler here
00:19:50.17 Taylor Kruse Right for me. range of motion and pain. Like if pain comes into play then I'm always using pain. But always range of motion. Yeah I mean that's just such a it's so easy Right. It.
00:20:03.17 Taylor Kruse Sometimes the work gets more specific. You need to get more specific. and And so like what we teach in our courses basically in our courses we go okay everybody. Congratulations you...
00:20:14.29 Taylor Kruse You've got this far. You've learned range of motion testing. You're using it Now we're going to tell you that We need to get more specific. Right. It's still going to be something. It's not going to go out of style. We're always going to use it but we need to start looking at other systems and we need to know how to test those specific systems so we can.
00:20:34.44 Taylor Kruse construct the most specific training. based on goals But really when you're just looking for high payoff drills. basic range of motion testing.
00:20:44.96 Taylor Kruse especially when you find a range of motion. that is giving you the fastest most reliable information. It works great. right For me it's a forward bend. right or as alicia was saying like if i have a specific pain or tension complaint then i'm also using some movement that may be reproducing that.
00:21:05.54 Taylor Kruse tension in pain. Yeah I'm always using a forward bend or a shoulder internal rotation because I get really good feedback from those two. Drills. Yeah.
00:21:17.05 Tony Fowler Yeah I find myself doing squats. just because I've been using my my knee pain as the...
00:21:20.05 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:21:22.94 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:21:23.92 Tony Fowler litmus test right? Um
00:21:25.23 Taylor Kruse yeah well that's a good point to make is just like any gross movement pattern is also a great A great way to go. Yeah it could be. It also could be a strength activity. Like it really just depends on the goal right?
00:21:37.73 Taylor Kruse You know if if you have... ah If you have pain during a pull-up Right? You could use you could use one pull-up as your assessment. Right? You know it's it's how... Yeah it's just based on what you want to accomplish. Most of the time I'm just using high payoff drills to like decompress.
00:21:54.64 Taylor Kruse And like. try to wind down. or get warmed up for a workout. So range of motion is super. applicable in those cases because it just tells you you got a change in your nervous system Um.
00:22:07.40 Taylor Kruse But yeah pain is a different story. I had pain. last week because I decided to go for a run for the first time.
00:22:12.83 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:22:13.12 Taylor Kruse and a while and I was motivated for a day.
00:22:17.08 Tony Fowler ah That's how running is for me too.
00:22:18.37 Taylor Kruse But I. Yeah it's... I love running but I hate running so. But I had some ankle pain creep up because of. the compression in my ankle i have a right side pmrf issue which is like a reflexive stability problem And so when I was running I think I was just compressing my ankle quite a bit. And so I was using that pain as a reassessment when I was trying to find some high payoffs for it. she was running downhill and it was loose gravel too because we're on a Dirt road.
00:22:46.55 Taylor Kruse with loose gravel and that's kind of a That's kind of a nemesis for you. Yeah because I have i also have like vestibular like balance. struggles as well so if this surface is unstable it's just like high threat for me in general But this is funny. So this is what it's like being married to an applied neuro person. so um I was sitting here doing...
00:23:05.80 Taylor Kruse uh work on the computer and then i got a text from alicia she because they were out for a walk she was out for a walk with our daughter and She was like am my ankle's doing that thing. And you might have to come pick us up Meaning?
00:23:19.20 Taylor Kruse We can't walk home.
00:23:20.13 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:23:20.93 Taylor Kruse pretty it's I mean it's like 10 out of 10 sharp. stabbing pain directly deep in the ankle joint. And so... I was like oh. That sucks and then like a couple minutes later a text comes through she's like But hang on I'm doing drills.
00:23:38.40 Tony Fowler And so you know to wait and see what what happens right?
00:23:38.77 Taylor Kruse Good. Yeah. yeah Couple minutes goes by. Okay you don't have to come pick us up. I fixed it for now. That's... That's what it's like having Great tools. right? I mean 10 out of 10 pain can't walk. Give me a few minutes. I'm fixing it. Okay. I'll see you at home. like you know and you You're pretty much through that now. Yeah it's i I won't run yet. I don't feel like I can run on it again yet. um
00:24:05.86 Taylor Kruse But yeah I can go for walks and everything now without any pain. Maybe you should describe your high payoff drill for. for that. Yeah so I... because I know that I have a right PMF. p m mrf pattern i did some left complex non-linear movement. So I did wrist.
00:24:23.97 Taylor Kruse ah mobility because it's an opposing joint to the right ankle so i always start there because it's like an immediate like it'll decrease the pain from like a 10 to a 5.
00:24:27.08 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:24:33.06 Taylor Kruse So the pain's still there but it kind of takes some stress off in the moment. And then just based on experience too I have a vision drill that always helps me. That is a rightward smooth pursuit.
00:24:45.39 Taylor Kruse So that. targets the right cortex which feeds into the PMRF. So you can get an effect on the the pain inhibition from doing that. So then I did did write. smooth pursuits like 15 reps of it.
00:24:58.56 Taylor Kruse um And then I discovered that. a a local nerve glide. ah peripheral nerve. drill for the peroneal nerve. was really targeted to the actual ankle. Like I just positioned myself in a way that.
00:25:12.76 Taylor Kruse it was targeting both the ankle and my pelvis because i tend to get compressed in my low back So it was mobilizing the nerve from. low back movements. while i was holding the position and that was like I walked off the ankle pain immediately after that.
00:25:28.13 Tony Fowler wow
00:25:28.82 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:25:29.57 Tony Fowler Um... There's a lot to dissect here. So let's let's let's attempt to do that. Um...
00:25:39.15 Tony Fowler You were looking for a high payoff drill. specifically for a novel pain. issue. Um So...
00:25:50.32 Tony Fowler that kind of brings up the the idea that your high payoff stroke high payoff drills might change. uh So it's not the same thing that you were doing.
00:26:01.86 Tony Fowler you know a month ago it's something completely different or are you using the same high payoff strategies to attack a new a new pain factor.
00:26:12.26 Taylor Kruse So I was using the same like... underlying theory. Because I know it's coming from a PMRF issue just based on history.
00:26:16.40 Tony Fowler here
00:26:20.98 Taylor Kruse and experience. So. I was choosing drills that target the PMRF but then I was considering the anatomy involved. So that's why I chose right. wrist drills instead of like a shoulder drill this is the difference between
00:26:33.08 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:26:35.69 Taylor Kruse generally seeking a high payoff? And not necessarily. Choosing the drill? based on what you know about your own brain and nervous system.
00:26:46.79 Taylor Kruse so And that's perfectly fine. to just look for drills that help you. with whatever your goal is. But it's very different when you already have an understanding of what you're kind of.
00:27:00.40 Taylor Kruse um you know underlying. pattern is. like Alicia does. So once you understand the pattern It means that You could have... Lots of different drills that potentially help you with a specific goal. So if given the chance I'm sure you could have found.
00:27:19.19 Taylor Kruse Several other... high payoff drills that did exactly the same thing but they would still be targeted to that same pattern that she knows about. Yeah.
00:27:27.03 Tony Fowler okay
00:27:27.83 Taylor Kruse which is... It's so cool. Right. It's not. I always tell our students like there's. There are lots of roads to the same. destination when you're trying to find drills as long as you have done enough initial testing.
00:27:43.91 Taylor Kruse to understand. a person's pattern.
00:27:48.93 Tony Fowler Yeah. Yeah. you started the the whole explanation with I have a history of a right PMRF.
00:27:56.37 Taylor Kruse right
00:27:57.52 Tony Fowler problem Right.
00:27:58.51 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:27:59.38 Tony Fowler Um... So... In that scenario you did three I think three. Distinct. Drills you did ah Opposing joint. So you did... ah like wrist circles on the Opposite arm side arm.
00:28:17.90 Tony Fowler ah You did. uh ah Smooth Pursuits to the right. um And. then so that's like a vision drill right?
00:28:27.66 Tony Fowler And then you did...
00:28:28.31 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:28:29.55 Tony Fowler nerve glide.
00:28:31.96 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm
00:28:31.92 Tony Fowler Is there an order of operations here? was...
00:28:34.93 Taylor Kruse I discovered it by accident.
00:28:36.73 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:28:37.11 Taylor Kruse So this is just... Like I think I had tried a nerve like. a nerve glide and i maybe didn't get such like a great result and so then I started thinking I needed to target the pattern more than just going right after the pain.
00:28:49.07 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:28:49.23 Taylor Kruse I even tried mobility on the right ankle first. So those were my initial steps that just didn't do anything. In fact mobilizing the ankle made it worse.
00:28:58.31 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:28:59.19 Taylor Kruse Um. And so I think by accident I started to discover that like. the left wrist. Mobility drills were reducing the pain initially and I started feeling changes in muscle tone So less tension kind of like on the right side more stable as I walked on it.
00:29:15.88 Taylor Kruse um And so. I just used that as a clue that I needed to start with that instead of the nerve guide first. And then if the pain came back which it did. walking later if I go if I went right to the nerve glide it wasn't such an immediate response so then I I decided to target.
00:29:31.92 Taylor Kruse based on the pattern first just to kind of recalibrate muscle tone so that then I could do the local drill with the nerve glide. Sort of by accident that you figured it out.
00:29:42.20 Tony Fowler Yeah. Yeah there's there's a logic there that makes sense though. like if you Do the higher order thing That. changes the tone and then reduces threat to the to the joint.
00:29:55.08 Tony Fowler then you can do the more local. Saying that. that. might have been a stressor earlier right?
00:30:01.12 Taylor Kruse Sure. yeah Mm hmm.
00:30:03.37 Tony Fowler Yeah fascinating. Fascinating. ah How long did this whole process take you?
00:30:08.43 Taylor Kruse um Well we were at the playground so like... maybe five or ten minutes.
00:30:13.26 Tony Fowler okay
00:30:14.64 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:30:14.86 Tony Fowler And how... how like if if you were to do like a left Wrist circle. or... ah Right. Uh... right-facing smooth pursuit.
00:30:26.75 Tony Fowler Do you do it? once? Do you do it for 30 seconds? Do you do it for two minutes? like how How much do you need to do? to notice a change.
00:30:35.85 Taylor Kruse So you can usually notice a change after a few reps. So you'll get some kind of response within a few reps and then you can just experiment. When I first discovered that smooth pursuits were high payoff for me I started with low repetition because vision has always been a threat for me.
00:30:52.14 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:30:52.52 Taylor Kruse So I started with like five reps and then as my stamina improved on that I eventually increased it to 10 reps and then 15 reps so that was just. Over time. um you assess it in the moment. and learn it whether or not you can keep going with repetition. So because I had a lot of experience with using that drill already.
00:31:12.03 Taylor Kruse I was able to just go right into 15 reps of it and not worry about it causing any threat.
00:31:17.23 Tony Fowler Mm hmm. And and you you learned that the hard way. You did. five and it felt good and then one day you did 25 and it It sucked.
00:31:25.92 Taylor Kruse Yeah I don't even remember. It was... I don't even remember because I started doing that. Oh it was because of the shoulder pain that I had two years ago. Do you remember that story of the shoulder pain that I had after?
00:31:36.62 Taylor Kruse There. that kid was drowning and i pulled him out of the water oh yeah yeah yeah
00:31:39.42 Tony Fowler Oh yeah. Taylor told this story once. yeah
00:31:42.51 Taylor Kruse I did tell that. Yeah. So my body went into like super shock after. that. situation and I had some severe shoulder pain. And that is when I discovered that smooth pursuits were helpful.
00:31:55.10 Taylor Kruse And I think it was one of those situations where the limited number of reps was helping me. So I did low dose and then eventually I turned that because I can get a little crazy with high payoff drills. So that I discovered was helping me so much that I decided to make it a thing and I started doing it for. I probably kept doing that every day for two years. After that.
00:32:16.85 Taylor Kruse Just to try to. target the system that I know is less. well you were Functional for me. You were getting... Bonus results. I was getting all kinds of changes. I started sleeping better.
00:32:28.52 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:32:28.99 Taylor Kruse Um... I don't even remember all this stuff I was feeling. I think you talked about sleeping better. i think Strength training better. Strength training. I think you talked about... um hormonal changes i did i started having feeling like i was having less stressful periods like it was just So you really pursued it because there was a lot. There was a lot happening. So I decided to really keep doing it. And that's.
00:32:51.71 Taylor Kruse That's what can happen a lot of times too when you find the right drills you you start doing them for one goal And then all of a sudden you you start to realize oh wow this is... This is really hitting a lot of other targets. It's it's kind of ah a bonus now you know and and that just gives you it's showing you the potential.
00:33:09.94 Taylor Kruse of approaching. the work that way a certain drill or a grouping of drills It's also giving you clues that finding other drills that... target those same brain areas could be really good.
00:33:22.13 Tony Fowler Mm hmm. um Is it safe to say that that's still your your go-to? Biggest bang for buck. High payoff. exercise or are there other contenders?
00:33:32.06 Taylor Kruse Yeah i don't I don't practice it as much now because I did do it for so long but I pull it out of the toolbox when I have a pain issue come up because I know it's going to be powerful. Um.
00:33:43.19 Taylor Kruse Right now I'm working on some... Smell? Okay.
00:33:47.04 Tony Fowler and Okay.
00:33:47.14 Taylor Kruse in the right nostril ah Because Taylor when we do the neuro dojo I'm like. the dump Like I come on and I'm the guinea pig.
00:33:54.62 Tony Fowler Uh-huh.
00:33:55.23 Taylor Kruse Um to show all the assessment process to our students so that they can learn how to do the assessments. and Every year that we do the neuro dojo we do the hearing test and I. my hearing on the left is like Not good. compared to the rights pretty significant deficit.
00:34:11.19 Taylor Kruse um And so I initially worked on that by working on hearing but then during the last NeuroDojo last fall Taylor... just randomly decided to test smell to see if it would improve my hearing.
00:34:22.03 Taylor Kruse And it improved it so much. And I hadn't seen that yet that I was like I need to practice smell in my right nostril. This was it was it was such a big result.
00:34:28.07 Tony Fowler Wow.
00:34:29.85 Taylor Kruse It was um like. People who don't know we actually ended up making an Instagram post out of it. People were mad about it. They were you it's a lot of anger they thought we like edited it and made it up but it was a live you know it was like a live session.
00:34:42.38 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:34:42.55 Taylor Kruse that we edited. um It's... It was so drastic. Anyone who... Like doesn't really know. What can happen with a... Applied neuro.
00:34:54.22 Taylor Kruse yeah It's just on it's not believable. 4. for them. right it's it's pretty it was pretty cool Yeah it was so cool that i I've been practicing smell in my right nostril while listening to sound in my left ear during my entire workout.
00:35:08.41 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:35:08.98 Taylor Kruse So I'll have a headphone on my left ear listening to like a podcast. And then every. in between every set of strength training I'll do some smell in the right nostril.
00:35:19.73 Taylor Kruse And bag breathing. Those are my two things right now.
00:35:22.41 Tony Fowler All right so i've I've got questions.
00:35:24.47 Taylor Kruse Okay.
00:35:24.07 Tony Fowler I've got questions. ah How do you know you're... hearing is improving do you just hear more clearly or Okay.
00:35:31.24 Taylor Kruse So we don't. No well in the moment Yeah it was in... You did the assessment. So we tested smell in my right nostril and he redid the test. And it was like the distance away from my ear that I could hear it was significant.
00:35:45.29 Tony Fowler oh this is where you're you're rubbing your fingers together next to her ear and slowly moving it away and then you're saying okay now i don't hear it
00:35:47.34 Taylor Kruse Yes. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep.
00:35:53.81 Tony Fowler That's the test?
00:35:54.16 Taylor Kruse yep
00:35:54.24 Tony Fowler Okay cool.
00:35:54.76 Taylor Kruse Yeah we we don't know yet if there's a long-term change in...
00:35:55.59 Tony Fowler Cool.
00:35:58.80 Taylor Kruse her ability to... To hear? In the moment it went from being just roughly outside of shoulder width so maybe like six to eight inches. to like four feet. from doing even more i just couldn't go any further yeah basically it was weird i was like I still hear it but I don't know how I still hear it because it sounds far away. And it's so cool. so Alicia you know how she mentioned the right PMRF pattern?
00:36:24.40 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:36:25.35 Taylor Kruse as she's been sort of learning more about herself over the last few years especially she's actually kind of figured out that Most of her problem is probably in the cortex.
00:36:38.18 Taylor Kruse and And so you when you when you have a... a distinct issue Of course we don't have the technology. to know okay it's it's right there it's in this area it's in that area so it's it's all based off of responses functional responses like what do you What are you getting?
00:36:54.87 Taylor Kruse uh good results from but then also like history and assessments and and so it's a guess but It seems like... She has more going on. in the cortex.
00:37:05.75 Taylor Kruse And so... the auditory. Testing. is a very strong... cortical assessment. There's other things involved too but it's a very strong cortical assessment and so is olfaction.
00:37:20.71 Taylor Kruse smelling. smelling But the neat thing here. is that If you look at the pathways. for like olfaction. Or sorry for sound processing.
00:37:32.82 Taylor Kruse So there's ah there's an auditory cortex. Where a lot of sound processing happens so when it when it arrives at the cortex there's an audit There's an auditory processing center in the temporal lobe.
00:37:46.28 Taylor Kruse And when you look at the pathways for smell. There is some involved pathways for smell in the temporal lobe. So there's some interesting connections. There's some other ones too.
00:37:58.16 Taylor Kruse But this is the whole idea of being able to use one stimulus. to affect an area of the brain to help out. A lacking.
00:38:09.35 Taylor Kruse Something. right In this case. Hearing. by using another sense. Really really cool to experience and to see.
00:38:20.27 Tony Fowler Um What? are you using as to smell like are you using like a smelling salt Or are you using...
00:38:26.93 Taylor Kruse I just use cloves.
00:38:28.36 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:38:28.90 Taylor Kruse So I just pulled the the clove spice out of the cupboard and that's what I'm using because I like the smell.
00:38:34.77 Tony Fowler okay
00:38:35.82 Taylor Kruse Yeah it doesn't even need to be anything special when you're just using smell as a stimulus Usually as long as it's strong enough you can detect it. you you know.
00:38:46.59 Taylor Kruse You can use almost whatever you want. It's different if you're trying to kind of taking it further if you were trying to restore the ability to smell. then that would...
00:38:57.29 Taylor Kruse that would be a lot more specific work right now it's more for her it's more about using the stimulus to you know create. better performance less pain. That kind of thing
00:39:09.85 Tony Fowler Do you think it matters that you like the smell of cloves?
00:39:13.98 Taylor Kruse uh good question it probably helps yeah i'm sure it helps yeah I wouldn't choose I wouldn't choose like cumin.
00:39:19.20 Tony Fowler Any any. theories as to why.
00:39:24.02 Taylor Kruse I mean when when we test. Olfaction we generally use like three different scents. three different odors Um You certainly can. see different responses from a different scent.
00:39:37.14 Taylor Kruse But again... In my experience anyways when it's high payoff it's high payoff. the difference between lemon oil and cloves might not be that big. you know if the person's getting a good response.
00:39:46.08 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:39:49.60 Tony Fowler Yeah I'm just wondering if... ah If we're talking about decreasing threat. specifically if like a a smell that you love and enjoy.
00:39:55.01 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:39:58.54 Taylor Kruse Oh there's no question.
00:39:59.06 Tony Fowler might be something different than like...
00:39:59.25 Taylor Kruse Yeah. youly
00:40:01.79 Tony Fowler something that's kind of off-putting or you have a negative connotation with or might be dangerous
00:40:04.03 Taylor Kruse mm-hmm Louie? You can do that. You can take that approach for high payoff work. very far. you could
00:40:12.02 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:40:12.50 Taylor Kruse You could use pleasant smells things that remind you of good memories. You can use visual stimulus. That is... ah You know.
00:40:24.13 Taylor Kruse brings up happy. feelings emotions. There's a lot you can do to decrease threat. um You can use... A photograph of somebody.
00:40:34.100 Taylor Kruse as a vision target. right or a place or there's there's you could really think through this if you wanted to really fine drills to reduce threat and do what we call neural chunking.
00:40:48.08 Taylor Kruse So... It's a lot more it's a lot deeper work and it's generally for. more sensitive issues very high threat. um But let's say...
00:40:59.61 Taylor Kruse Let's say you were in a car accident And ah you... You got a neck injury you got a concussion. you got these these things and maybe your your visual system became very let's just say oversensitive and Maybe there's a specific eye.
00:41:15.66 Taylor Kruse position. that is causing you a lot of problems because of where your eyes were When you were struck by another vehicle.
00:41:23.83 Tony Fowler a
00:41:24.58 Taylor Kruse It's almost like you can look at it as the nervous system remembers the inputs that were present. when there was trauma. And. It's almost remembered.
00:41:36.28 Taylor Kruse Right? Because the brain is so wired for survival. that it makes sense that... Sort of. being able to remember what inputs were present.
00:41:47.89 Taylor Kruse when something bad happened. could actually be a useful survival tactic. So people kind of get locked into these patterns. And...
00:41:58.56 Taylor Kruse perhaps a way to start to decrease threat because the sensitivity of that can be quite challenging. You know if someone can't move their eyes to the left at all. to do to retrain a specific visual skill.
00:42:13.25 Taylor Kruse then maybe we have to use... smells that are pleasant. Maybe we have to... Use photographs as visual targets. There's a lot of things you can do for neural chunking.
00:42:24.94 Taylor Kruse The other... kind of way to look at this is Let's say... somebody became oversensitized by I'll use the car accident example again.
00:42:36.71 Taylor Kruse What if there was a really strong what if somebody got in a car accident they were trapped in their car. for an extended amount of time and there was a really strong smell of gasoline. you could actually become hypersensitized.
00:42:50.37 Taylor Kruse to a smell that was present. during a traumatic event And now maybe every time you smell something that reminds your brain and nervous system of gasoline your neck gets tight your headache comes back.
00:43:03.74 Tony Fowler Yeah threat goes way up yeah.
00:43:04.37 Taylor Kruse your anxiety goes up. right It's not out of the question. And so then it... brings up the kind of i case for We have to reduce threat enough and restore your ability to handle.
00:43:18.86 Taylor Kruse the smell of gasoline again. so that it doesn't trigger. all of the increased threat. So maybe now you're using a bunch of high payoff stimuli together.
00:43:30.68 Taylor Kruse to create something stacked. that's going to make your brain and nervous system happy. And then you're introducing. The threatening smell. And this is what neural chunking really is to us anyway.
00:43:43.98 Taylor Kruse where you're now introducing the threat. It's the threat inoculation piece but you're doing it. in the presence of all these other good stimuli so your brain is happy about it. And in the goal then is to hopefully reduce threat.
00:43:57.64 Taylor Kruse And make. make that smell not as as threatening.
00:44:06.36 Tony Fowler fascinating stuff i've i've got ah an analogy for pet lovers all right um So we have cats here. And... they love hanging out with us they follow us around everywhere but when there's people guests here They tend to hide as cats do.
00:44:21.82 Tony Fowler Um But if we hang out long enough... with them. with with guests they might come down and they might get curious or whatnot
00:44:29.64 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:44:29.85 Tony Fowler But if people come to take care of the cats when we're not there they never see them. Um... And... So my analogy here is. This is like neural chunking. They're okay.
00:44:41.22 Tony Fowler with coming to... see this guest this new person that's Stranger Danger. if we're also present.
00:44:47.68 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:44:47.99 Tony Fowler So we're the familiar smell.
00:44:48.38 Taylor Kruse You're the high payoff. yeah you're
00:44:50.04 Tony Fowler we're the We're the nice part of that. And then the threatening vector is kind of sneaking in with us. And... They get used to it eventually. They'll they'll be really friendly.
00:45:00.88 Tony Fowler But.
00:45:00.99 Taylor Kruse A hundred percent.
00:45:01.56 Tony Fowler It takes a while.
00:45:01.64 Taylor Kruse and and And I think about that exact scenario only. As a parent. this is like This is so basic.
00:45:07.95 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:45:09.48 Taylor Kruse this This idea. is so basic but nobody really... i Like... It's invisible. to most people. right Well in the parenting world they call it scaffolding where you're trying to like build changes in slowly.
00:45:24.52 Taylor Kruse So like if you want your child that we actually had to do this last year with our daughter. because school was not going to happen unless we did some kind of like scaffolding.
00:45:32.68 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:45:32.81 Taylor Kruse Like I had to be present. I went to summer camp. Yes. Okay. Thankfully we had teachers who were willing to let me stay for summer camp.
00:45:41.37 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:45:42.74 Taylor Kruse Um. So like I was there and I was inside the fence. And then slowly I worked myself to be outside the fence and watch from the outside where she could see me.
00:45:51.62 Tony Fowler uh-huh
00:45:53.13 Taylor Kruse But that was too fast. So then she had to come outside the fence with me. So we spent the day sitting outside the fence. while she watched the other kids play so like you have to like slowly remove yourself by creating a safer more comfortable familiar situation.
00:46:07.66 Taylor Kruse It's literally applied neuro. Yeah.
00:46:10.04 Tony Fowler Hmm.
00:46:10.43 Taylor Kruse it' That's what it is. That's what we're doing. with drills. We're trying to help people get out of pain. That's what we're doing. We are... And we're just...
00:46:23.31 Taylor Kruse We're suggesting to the nervous system. You know we're... It's a very it could be a very subtle process. you know It's interesting to think about it like that.
00:46:35.69 Taylor Kruse Because then if you think about it like that it's the same with almost every goal. You know especially pain goals Yeah.
00:46:47.70 Tony Fowler So Taylor let's let's turn to you for a bit.
00:46:50.50 Taylor Kruse Sure.
00:46:50.88 Tony Fowler Uh... Tell us about your high payoff. drills and exercises.
00:46:54.55 Taylor Kruse Well this is an interest This is an interesting... Period of my life to ask me about my high payoffs because previously I would have said you know I've i've got these five drills.
00:47:06.39 Taylor Kruse And I rely on them. quite heavily to to feel My best. and move my best. and And I've had those five drills for... years. They're always... Roughly.
00:47:19.39 Taylor Kruse the same five um Slight change here and there depending on what I discover. And I can say what those are and in a minute if we want but but the reason why I'm... i'm Starting this way is because right now The highest payoff.
00:47:34.83 Taylor Kruse drill or practice for me. It's focusing on my nutrition. by a long shot. So this is very interesting because for the first time since You know.
00:47:48.38 Taylor Kruse Getting in. deep with all this work. I've found that I... don't really rely on my physical high payoff drills that much anymore.
00:47:59.30 Taylor Kruse I still do them let's say as part of a warmup for training. you know Or sometimes i I'll tell ah a story in a minute about ah a cool use for a high payoff drill. But as far as feeling my best and moving my best the highest payoff thing for me has been focusing on my nutrition.
00:48:16.66 Taylor Kruse because I had a lot of internal threat coming from gut issues. And. This is something worth mentioning because...
00:48:28.02 Taylor Kruse Inflammation or inflammatory process is almost like a background noise. It's like the dial is turned up to a specific place and you've got a certain level of background noise that is the inflammation process.
00:48:41.65 Taylor Kruse And my dial got turned up too high And so. Doing... high payoff drills became something that Rather than giving me... more of a long-term type of result.
00:48:54.64 Taylor Kruse um feeling good for a long time like i was used to Things were extremely temporary. Because that dial was turned up higher than it had ever been turned up and I couldn't Catch up.
00:49:06.87 Taylor Kruse I couldn't catch up.
00:49:06.91 Tony Fowler here
00:49:08.09 Taylor Kruse so you know Many months. Fast forward many months to you know when the hope this whole. sort of process started and i've told the story several times now on the podcast with probably the most detail in in the episode that we did in January.
00:49:23.99 Taylor Kruse about mold toxicity and several gut issues as a result of that. and And that's really what had my dial turned up. So been working on decreasing. inflammation through changing my nutrition ah my My diet has changed a lot in the last six months.
00:49:41.05 Taylor Kruse I've you know been going through various supplement protocols to help me with the specific things that... I have going on. And because that dial has now been turned down and I've decreased internal threats.
00:49:54.59 Taylor Kruse I'm no longer feeling as dependent on my physical high payoffs. which is really cool I think in one of the podcasts not long ago I said the highest payoff thing that I've ever done for my general hip mobility is improve my gut health.
00:50:09.40 Tony Fowler here
00:50:09.77 Taylor Kruse And I still feel that way. So for me... That's where I met with all of my focus. um the most energy I'm putting into that category right now.
00:50:22.18 Tony Fowler This reminds me of like a... Okay. Uh When you talk about people with fuel issues.
00:50:28.30 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
00:50:28.68 Tony Fowler where it's like you might find something that works but It doesn't last.
00:50:32.74 Taylor Kruse Yes.
00:50:33.56 Tony Fowler And... And you know things are popping up and you you deal with one problem and then another problem pops up somewhere else. and It's kind of like whack-a-mole right?
00:50:39.72 Taylor Kruse That's right That's right.
00:50:42.04 Tony Fowler This gut issue seems like... a similar...
00:50:45.85 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:50:45.86 Tony Fowler Or maybe the same the same problem.
00:50:47.02 Taylor Kruse It is a fuel problem.
00:50:48.11 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:50:48.48 Taylor Kruse It ends up being a fuel problem. It is a fuel problem but it was really coming down to like how you're digesting and absorbing food because we get this everybody always comments when we talk about a fuel problem if we think they have one that they eat healthy they're active they're fit.
00:51:05.24 Taylor Kruse um So they feel like they're doing all the things and it shouldn't be a fuel problem. But. We don't know how your body is actually digesting and absorbing the food and how your immune system is responding to that food either. And you really need other testing to figure that out.
00:51:19.84 Taylor Kruse I mean when when we were at...
00:51:19.78 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:51:21.42 Taylor Kruse you know peak uh you know I don't know what to call it. For me when I was at the peak of... what my symptoms were and stuff.
00:51:32.52 Taylor Kruse you know My diet at that point was probably better than most people. I still I had things that needed to change.
00:51:36.50 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:51:38.89 Taylor Kruse For sure. And I've made those changes. but If you were to compare how I was... eating to someone else it probably would have been considered. quite healthy compared to most.
00:51:50.64 Taylor Kruse Didn't matter. Didn't matter. It was a totally different level of issues internally going on. mild infection not absorbing. not absorbing all the nutrients from my food.
00:52:03.09 Tony Fowler mm-hmm
00:52:03.76 Taylor Kruse And then that was throwing off my my blood sugar. And that's really when a cascade of negative things you know would happen symptomatically. So it's. it's It's important to remember that.
00:52:14.08 Taylor Kruse You know we always we always hear well I do eat healthy. Yeah but what if that inflammatory response is there and that background noise that dial is turned up? um You know we have to deal with that. It's it's the same philosophy.
00:52:28.93 Taylor Kruse that we talk about with the threat bucket. It's just that the thing that was... Filling up my threat bucket the most and the fastest was internal health. um challenges.
00:52:39.70 Taylor Kruse right And yeah stacking on physical high payoff drills to that will only take you so far.
00:52:46.93 Taylor Kruse But here's a...
00:52:46.92 Tony Fowler Yeah I think that there's a...
00:52:47.79 Taylor Kruse Go ahead sorry.
00:52:49.13 Tony Fowler Um... like a primary cause. problem here right? and And I think a lot of what we're doing...
00:52:55.10 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:52:57.64 Tony Fowler with Applied Neuro is is Trying to suss that out. right like you're you might be dealing with secondary effects
00:53:02.37 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:53:05.74 Tony Fowler and and you know stacks might be more and more targeted. But there might be that one thing. you know in the background that's...
00:53:12.74 Taylor Kruse That's right.
00:53:14.70 Tony Fowler that's really turning up the threat and if you find that... Uh
00:53:20.29 Tony Fowler Good things could happen right?
00:53:20.49 Taylor Kruse I mean... This is what we always tell our students. I mean it's very interesting to experience this when you're working with other people. but As a person gets healthier... they generally need less stimulus of drills.
00:53:34.22 Taylor Kruse it's It's cool. Right. It's. um And that's kind of what I'm experiencing. Like I don't need to go and do lumbar front circles and thoracic glides diaphragm stretches and tibial nerve glides.
00:53:47.15 Taylor Kruse every single day maybe twice a day. To not feel. you know tension in my body and feel like my best. i I don't really need to lean on those things anymore which is really great.
00:53:59.81 Taylor Kruse um And then I will take them out of the toolbox. if You know I have one of those days where I feel I do need them. but uh right now If I'm on top of... My nutrition.
00:54:10.70 Taylor Kruse and staying up with my supplements and Making sure I'm... getting a you know reasonable reasonable enough sleep. and getting those uh Two.
00:54:22.45 Taylor Kruse feel pathetic saying it but two exercise sessions a week is currently my goal.
00:54:25.99 Tony Fowler ah
00:54:27.100 Taylor Kruse um if i get all that in and you know i'm i'm it's a good recipe for me and I don't need to go. Chasing any... yeah Any discomfort with high payoffs?
00:54:38.60 Taylor Kruse Well you're kind of rebuilding your foundation. exactly Your strength foundations because that was kind of lost during. the worst of it. He couldn't strength train at all. So. Yeah. Yeah but you know here's a cool...
00:54:50.87 Taylor Kruse story so I generally don't have like fitness goals anymore. Like fitness is the most boring thing to me. i I would rather... I don't even know how to describe it. Like it's just like my gosh doing another workout here. Like I've only been doing this since I was 13.
00:55:06.10 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:55:06.20 Taylor Kruse Like. It's just become this thing where like i love I love movement and I like to explore it. um I would be perfectly happy. Doing something different movement wise every single day I wouldn't be perfectly happy. having to think about what that's going to be. So if somebody were to say hey.
00:55:26.23 Taylor Kruse I'm going to give you a novel workout every single day. That would be fantastic. but it you know it doesn't work like that. And I know the value of consistency with the same basics. And so I know I have to achieve that to some degree. So I generally i generally don't have...
00:55:42.54 Taylor Kruse fitness goals anymore. Everything is. i guess the one big goal is more longevity based and health-based. But. Recently... Because I just my body's been feeling a lot better during one of my workouts i was like i wonder if i could do a one-arm push-up And so I got down I set it all up and I.
00:56:01.08 Taylor Kruse I did like. Three. Really we would have to say like two. but but i was like pretty i was like pretty impressed i was like okay that position was pretty good like not a ton of compensation like i think that was legit And I did two of them and I was like all right nice.
00:56:17.62 Taylor Kruse And for whatever reason the next workout I was like let me see if I could do that again. So I did another two. a couple sets of two on each side. noticed that my My right side.
00:56:28.97 Taylor Kruse For my right side it was harder. It's like okay. And I really liked it. and honestly those two sets of two made me sore it's like oh Wow. And I just for whatever reason next workout I was like I'll try that again. And then I just got into this groove of and doing these one arm pushups.
00:56:45.48 Taylor Kruse during each one of my workouts And um after you know I think my third time through instead of two I got three. I was like oh cool. I wonder how far I could take this. So the next several workouts I was like all right I'm actually going to like.
00:56:59.71 Taylor Kruse put some effort in here. instead of just doing it and expecting to get better like okay you know stuff can you just like make this happen faster So I started thinking about the one-arm push-up.
00:57:07.97 Tony Fowler mm-hmm
00:57:10.43 Taylor Kruse What could I do to help this? So I started doing our tried and true pencil push-ups right? The vision exercise where you follow the tip of the pen into the... a tip of your nose and back out.
00:57:21.61 Taylor Kruse And I chose that drill specifically because it's quite good for facilitating flexor tone. And when you look at movement patterns with neurology We generally categorize flexion and adduction together.
00:57:35.98 Taylor Kruse as being the same thing. So when you do a pushup. and you're you're pushing yourself up off the ground. It's a lot of flexion and adduction coming from the shoulder. There's a lot of trunk muscles right flexor muscles that have to engage.
00:57:50.32 Taylor Kruse Certainly it's not all flexors but... It's a lot. So I started doing some vision work convergence work. So I did a set of pencil push-ups. I went back to my one arm. Push-ups.
00:58:01.52 Taylor Kruse And instead of doing doing three I did five. I was like okay that was cool.
00:58:06.07 Tony Fowler Yeah that's a big jump.
00:58:07.32 Taylor Kruse Yeah. So and I did five on each side but the right was still challenging more challenging. I really had to grind it out and I was losing stability in the last rep or two. So that's how it went.
00:58:16.95 Tony Fowler are you Are you right-hand dominant by the way?
00:58:17.31 Taylor Kruse Next. Yes yeah
00:58:19.52 Tony Fowler Interesting. Okay.
00:58:20.20 Taylor Kruse Yes yes so that's another thing to mention is that so classically like traditionally for me I show more of a right PMRF pattern So even though I'm right handed I'm right-hand dominant.
00:58:32.21 Taylor Kruse I still have. more of a reflexive stabilization challenge. or muscle tone issue on my right side compared to my left. That's probably what.
00:58:42.64 Taylor Kruse i was experiencing So... the The workouts kept going on and and it wasn't really that many. The next time I used the same convergence work. Now I'm i'm doing three or four working sets in a workout.
00:58:55.68 Taylor Kruse pencil push-ups before each set of one arm push-ups. um I got to seven. the next time. both sides. I started feeling cool. It's like I'm going to put this on Instagram so I can show people that I can do this.
00:59:08.58 Tony Fowler I still got it
00:59:08.78 Taylor Kruse Um so you know some people hey that's fantastic and then other people like i think you're uh the way that you film that it's it's uh you you actually were widening your stance you didn't have the increase in strength it's because you you know and i had to go through all that I'm like actually I was closer to the camera that time I set it up.
00:59:29.97 Tony Fowler Yeah yeah.
00:59:31.23 Taylor Kruse Pretty much the same. Anyway. So it kept going. And anyways this has only been now about. i don't know Five weeks of. one arm push-ups. And the other day I did 10 on each arm with no pencil push-ups.
00:59:47.41 Taylor Kruse So no additional high payoff stimulus. And I got 10 and I was like nice this is. Awesome. So then I was like okay now what? I wonder if I could do a one-arm pull-up.
01:00:00.45 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:00:00.33 Taylor Kruse And so now to be continued I've just started to yeah.
01:00:02.92 Tony Fowler So... You started this whole conversation being like I'm not interested in training. Like strength training is boring.
01:00:08.27 Taylor Kruse I know. I will.
01:00:09.78 Tony Fowler And now you're. You're attacking these.
01:00:12.58 Taylor Kruse So...
01:00:13.95 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:00:13.71 Taylor Kruse I will ditch this so fast.
01:00:16.62 Tony Fowler ah
01:00:16.90 Taylor Kruse I don't like this about myself. But I will ditch this so fast.
01:00:20.87 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:00:21.22 Taylor Kruse You might ask me. Hey did you ever? Get that one arm pull up. And I don't know. Three months from now I'm either still going to be working on it or the fishing got good and I forgot about it.
01:00:27.69 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:00:33.32 Taylor Kruse Yeah. So we'll see. So I'm very happy with the one arm pushups and I used. you know an applied stimulus to help me get to the goal which in my mind I was like I wonder how long ah it would take me to do 10.
01:00:44.13 Taylor Kruse And I used a vision drill to get there. And now... Yesterday I did some one-arm pull-ups assisted using my other arm a little bit.
01:00:51.97 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:00:52.62 Taylor Kruse And I was like you know what? That feels... That feels relatively solid. like So now I got to search for some high payoffs that might help me with that. And we'll see how far I take it.
01:01:02.71 Tony Fowler That's a really interesting use of ah of a high payoff drill. Um
01:01:06.98 Taylor Kruse It's the use that I wish more people would understand. But the thing is everyone's interested in pain.
01:01:10.00 Tony Fowler Yeah. Right.
01:01:13.24 Taylor Kruse Pain is the ultimate motivator. A lot of... times people don't realize you can use this stuff. Anytime we post a drill to improve performance on Instagram the video just tanks.
01:01:24.77 Taylor Kruse People just don't watch it. don't watch it They only watch it when it involves pain. Yep.
01:01:28.43 Tony Fowler That's wild to me.
01:01:29.86 Taylor Kruse I know we've tried it so many times.
01:01:30.07 Tony Fowler That's wild. Where are all the like power lifters and Olympic lifters?
01:01:34.100 Taylor Kruse I know. It's ridiculous. like
01:01:37.59 Tony Fowler yeah
01:01:38.26 Taylor Kruse An Olympic lifter. or a power lifter could get so much out of these basic activation drills it is startling. I mean when I'm just messing around I can add I can add 25 pounds to a lift.
01:01:53.76 Taylor Kruse with a simple activation. From a neuro drill and you had you had Our daughter do a pull-up the other day using yeah eye position. we I mentioned it. oh yeah I mentioned it on ah on the episode.
01:02:03.85 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:02:05.16 Taylor Kruse Yeah just forget just the correct eye position.
01:02:05.65 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:02:08.35 Taylor Kruse She went from Can't do a dead hang pull up to. doing a dead hang pull-up. So yeah I mean it's it's such a cool use. It's a way to potentiate.
01:02:19.57 Taylor Kruse Something in... The thing is that community of. that type of athlete they're already into the idea of potentiation drills. Like they are already at least the smart ones.
01:02:32.46 Taylor Kruse that understand. are doing something. to help potentiate their performance before they do it. And the thing is with Applied Neuro is... Our tools are stronger.
01:02:44.74 Taylor Kruse So somebody might say oh I'm gonna foam roll a little bit. you know I'm going to foam roll my body a little bit and that helps me feel like I'm in the squat position deeper and better and it helps me.
01:02:56.46 Taylor Kruse And that's Applied Neuro. Right?
01:02:58.77 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:02:59.19 Taylor Kruse Um You know somebody might roll the bottom of their feet. you know get the pain to decrease that maybe they're experiencing and then they notice oh this helps me with this other thing.
01:03:10.29 Taylor Kruse somebody might... use a more isolated type of exercise. maybe for their shoulder and then They go into an overhead.
01:03:21.92 Taylor Kruse Position with the bar over their head and they go. Okay. Yep. I'm in the position better it's easier for me to do this That's the same thing It's just that the tools from a that go with Applied Neuro are way more powerful.
01:03:37.36 Taylor Kruse so it only can get better.
01:03:37.42 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:03:39.37 Taylor Kruse it's It's really... Yeah. you I wish more people. saw that part of it.
01:03:46.98 Tony Fowler I mean the main difference that I'm seeing from my vantage point is the the systematic assessment. So smelling salts for example like that's a known. tactic used by
01:03:57.82 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:03:58.50 Tony Fowler ah lifters. um They use smelling salts right before their lift. It amps them up.
01:04:03.40 Taylor Kruse Yep.
01:04:03.60 Tony Fowler Um There's neuro going on there right?
01:04:06.03 Taylor Kruse Totally.
01:04:06.08 Tony Fowler You guys could... Could. you know expound upon theories as to why what part of the brain is that activating? What deficit might it be helping with?
01:04:16.18 Tony Fowler Why? what muscle tone changes are happening right?
01:04:17.26 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:04:20.68 Tony Fowler um But I think a lot of people. are just... They see someone else do it. They take the smelling salt. They try it. And that's the whole story.
01:04:31.03 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:04:31.15 Tony Fowler um Whereas you guys would assess it. and say is this working for me? Is this not? Is it actually being... counterproductive why
01:04:39.35 Taylor Kruse Right.
01:04:39.56 Tony Fowler And so. it's the assess it's the It's the systematic assessment I think that kind of sets... what you're doing a part.
01:04:47.80 Taylor Kruse Yeah. And if you're an athlete. and you're trying to improve a specific skill It could be could be dead lifting But it also could be. serving a tennis ball.
01:04:58.23 Taylor Kruse right It doesn't matter what the actual athletic skill is.
01:04:58.51 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm
01:05:02.12 Taylor Kruse the The key... is rather than using range of motion testing like we started out talking about as being like. the starting place The key to make... the work more specific is to use the Desired.
01:05:17.37 Taylor Kruse performance goal as your assessment.
01:05:20.57 Tony Fowler Right.
01:05:20.72 Taylor Kruse So the the dead blith... then becomes your assessment or serving a tennis ball becomes your assessment. and that's a fun way to apply this material.
01:05:29.75 Tony Fowler Very intuitive. and that you know That's sort of what I've been...
01:05:31.25 Taylor Kruse Yes.
01:05:33.58 Tony Fowler drawn to is I keep forgetting to do range of motion assessments because I really just want to be able to squat with my knee and not have issues. So that's always the assessment. You know what I mean?
01:05:44.18 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:05:44.56 Tony Fowler um And it's just very very intuitive to do it that way.
01:05:48.04 Taylor Kruse like like For example Tony you've been talking about practicing juggling.
01:05:51.53 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:05:52.11 Taylor Kruse So juggling could become your assessment. If you wanted to work on it as a skill and then you could explore maybe another vision drill or. uh you know other other things whatever that those things might be and then you you come back to juggling it's still your time to practice juggling but you're also asking yourself hey was this better same or worse than last time?
01:06:14.30 Tony Fowler That's such a good point. because I'm already using it. Just to... assess how I'm feeling.
01:06:22.72 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:06:23.00 Tony Fowler Generally like... ah You know I'll be sitting down. Okay. working on a podcast or before a workout. um And so i'll I'll kind of juggle. Every once in a while Alicia ah Taylor basically got me thinking about juggling.
01:06:38.09 Tony Fowler So I got some scarves and then I got some sandbags and.
01:06:39.78 Taylor Kruse Nice.
01:06:42.29 Tony Fowler It's been really fun. It's been a really fun process. But yeah sometimes I... i'm i'm not great at it generally but sometimes i'm really bad at it
01:06:52.85 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:06:53.36 Tony Fowler And it's so closely correlated to like how I'm. feeling in general am i feeling kind of lethargic and brain foggy and
01:07:01.06 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm
01:07:01.48 Tony Fowler Um You know it's really obvious to me when I can't focus on... work. or I'm really dragging my feet on a workout. That the juggling also sucks.
01:07:12.25 Tony Fowler And then sometimes it's just like.
01:07:12.74 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:07:14.23 Tony Fowler I'm in a flow state. It's just going easy. I can walk backwards and forwards and like. I'm also more articulate and I'm in a better mood and I'm peppy. so Um... It definitely correlates with just like my.
01:07:28.02 Tony Fowler My general... how I'm feeling. But to your point I could be more targeted and I could say okay. I've been doing pencil pushups. Why don't I throw that in?
01:07:39.98 Tony Fowler And...
01:07:40.32 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:07:41.26 Tony Fowler see like okay did my juggling improve or not
01:07:43.69 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:07:44.62 Tony Fowler Um
01:07:44.61 Taylor Kruse Definitely if if that's if that's your the skill that you're working on. that For sure.
01:07:49.94 Tony Fowler yeah Um... I wanted to to flag this. Do you both have... ah right PMRF pattern.
01:08:00.99 Taylor Kruse Yeah but different. presentation um so there's other patterns to consider that can be happening at the same time. So. I'm left handed. I tend to have a right cerebellar pattern instead of a left cerebellar pattern which is more common for people that have right PMRF issues.
01:08:17.70 Taylor Kruse They tend to have a left cerebellar.
01:08:18.13 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:08:19.91 Taylor Kruse um deficit but I have a right cerebellar deficit with the right PMRF. So it's a different presentation and experience. And I also tend to have more midline issues. So more going on in like the spine and the trunk.
01:08:33.86 Taylor Kruse I've always been predominantly a right PMRF pattern. Um And I think ah probably a fair amount. of that again this is all talk because I don't actually No but like based on history and assessments.
01:08:48.86 Taylor Kruse Probably some of that is driven by my right cortex. particularly The frontal lobe is where I think I probably have my most challenges. But interestingly too...
01:09:01.16 Taylor Kruse And that has improved a lot over the years for sure. um Posturally and I have an old gate video and I feel like I misplaced it. and i i thought i had it saved on a drive and i might but i really hope i find that someday because i have a gate video from way back when Basically it was my first gait assessment.
01:09:22.33 Taylor Kruse Probably like 2000. 14 ish or something when I remember how... distinctly that pattern was in my gate. where I had a ah lot of postural.
01:09:33.69 Taylor Kruse things going on. and a lot of tension chronic tension to kind of go with it. See i've I've been that pattern. for Um you know for pretty much forever and it's improved quite a bit but then during the peak of having all the challenges that i've had In the last.
01:09:53.17 Taylor Kruse six years with um starting with the mold toxicity i actually started developing a left pmrf which was interesting. And.
01:10:03.83 Taylor Kruse I think I've almost... I think I've annihilated that actually with just all of the good things that have happened through changing my diet and supplementation.
01:10:15.26 Taylor Kruse But that was becoming very... clear to me and strange because I was having a lot of left-sided chronic pain. I've never.
01:10:23.73 Tony Fowler where traditionally it was right-sided right?
01:10:25.64 Taylor Kruse Yes I've never had left-sided issues.
01:10:26.49 Tony Fowler yeah
01:10:28.92 Taylor Kruse And I was having... uh some stability issues on that left side again that's not really something i've ever experienced posturally i was starting to notice a couple things it was weird i was like oh my gosh i starting to see you know
01:10:43.62 Taylor Kruse Allah. pmrf and Never. I've never experienced that. and that That's like gone. so It was developing You know because of the way my... my uh brain and nervous system was being um challenged you know through through that time.
01:11:00.49 Taylor Kruse and something and to think about when it comes to patterns is if two people have a right pmrf issue it could be stemming from And... left cerebellar issue it could be a right cortex issue or it could be a right brain stem issue And so. the assessments and drills that we choose and whatever happens as a result of those assessments help kind of guide our thinking onto the brain area that might be causing that issue.
01:11:26.21 Taylor Kruse Because I tend to have more of a right cortex issue as well. Taylor said his was frontal lobe mines more parietal. Um And so it's just I do different drills. to target the same issue.
01:11:37.65 Tony Fowler Yeah that that that's where I was going with it. I was like okay. Both have. Alright. pmrf pattern are you
01:11:44.21 Taylor Kruse Yep.
01:11:44.95 Tony Fowler finding the same drills work for you and why or why not and that That makes sense right?
01:11:49.38 Taylor Kruse Yeah. yeah no no it's never really been similar it's that's that's what's so interesting about each person being you know pretty pretty unique. I have had.
01:12:01.68 Taylor Kruse so smell sometimes is a good stimulus for me but it's never been wildly high payoff i've done quite good with like uh cor cranial nerve activations that are you know specifically targeted at the right side of the brain stem so i do Quite well things that are generally high payoff for me are like tongue exercises
01:12:21.13 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:12:21.33 Taylor Kruse which stimulate several cranial nerves but... um Uh cranial nerve 12. uh 10 there's just several there but Those have been really good for me.
01:12:32.96 Taylor Kruse Um cranial nerve 11 drills where i do like different things with for the upper and mid traps and Yeah. yeah've ah That's been good. And then i've done I've always done extremely well with left-sided complex nonlinear movement.
01:12:48.68 Taylor Kruse And that was the thing that... drove my biggest improvements initially when I first learned of my right PMRF pattern. I just did all my complex non-linear joint mo mobilizations on the left side of my body And I.
01:13:02.07 Taylor Kruse I did most of them on the left side of my body for a long time. and that drove ah a lot of changes Really something that I forget about that always helps you is anti-saccades. Oh yeah. Whether it's movement or vision or whatever you get a big effect from that.
01:13:13.31 Tony Fowler Antistocrats.
01:13:14.85 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Yeah.
01:13:16.29 Tony Fowler What are those?
01:13:16.57 Taylor Kruse Eat it. describe that so so a visual saccade is a rapid eye movement or if you want to think about it as a jump from one target to another target so when we do traditionally a saccade test or exercise would be Your whole dirt.
01:13:33.17 Taylor Kruse Let's say a pen. in each hand arm's length out in front of you. Let's say two. three feet apart. and you jump your eyes back and forth. From the right target to the left target. That's a saccade so it's not a tracking exercise like a pursuit where you're following a moving target
01:13:49.17 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:13:49.27 Taylor Kruse you actually are jumping from one. to the other So that's traditionally what a saccade is an anti-saccade is different An anti-saccade can be done... several different ways but for example if i was to guide somebody through the exercise i would stand in front of them with a target in each hand.
01:14:07.52 Taylor Kruse And I might say okay client I want you to look at my nose. That's where I want your eyes to begin. And when I... Move one of the visual targets very quickly. and at this point They're going to sense the movement. with peripheral vision.
01:14:21.23 Tony Fowler yeah Okay.
01:14:22.41 Taylor Kruse So. If I move the right target. Client I want you to jump your eyes. to the left target. So it's it's they have to inhibit the impulse to go to in my what is my right target.
01:14:40.01 Taylor Kruse they have to inhibit that impulse and go to the opposite target. And so you would guide them through the drill like that. It's in the same family of exercise as Simon says
01:14:50.62 Taylor Kruse or red light green light.
01:14:52.31 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm
01:14:52.64 Taylor Kruse or any kind of stop go. playful type of game where you have to inhibit the impulse to do something that is very reflexive and easy or whatever.
01:15:03.72 Taylor Kruse And you have to make. the opposite movement. um That is an...
01:15:07.45 Tony Fowler So yeah.
01:15:08.100 Taylor Kruse That is a phenomenal training stimulus. Four. the cortex specifically the frontal lobe
01:15:17.97 Tony Fowler That's so cool. Um... Let's see where are we here?
01:15:33.05 Tony Fowler So I guess briefly I'll just walk you through a couple of mine. And I'm curious on your thoughts and comments.
01:15:37.72 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:15:39.78 Tony Fowler um When I first... was kind of um I guess rehabbing my. My knee. Um Alicia I had like a...
01:15:52.60 Tony Fowler I guess they said it was like the PCL. maybe was had ah had a tear or something. um it was never They never really figured it out. Anyways I had issues where I had like pain when I would be in a squatting position or if I was getting up from a seated position.
01:16:07.28 Tony Fowler Um... And... One of the things Taylor recommended actually was knee circles right? And so I really. found that knee circles were very helpful with
01:16:17.08 Taylor Kruse um
01:16:19.74 Tony Fowler inhibiting pain. And specifically he recommended a band. assisted knee circles. So I would put a band on a post and then I would put it.
01:16:30.27 Tony Fowler kind of around like below the knee joint. Um And I would push against it in a clockwise position. I assessed both. counterclockwise and clockwise.
01:16:40.54 Tony Fowler Counterclockwise made it worse. Clockwise made it better. And that band. Support. I think also was was super helpful.
01:16:49.16 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:16:50.94 Tony Fowler I don't do that anymore but I still do knee circles and I still do them in the... Same clockwise position specifically with my right knee. And I find that that's very reliable. N.
01:17:03.38 Tony Fowler helping with that. with that knee pain Um Another thing that he had mentioned once... That is it still blows my mind.
01:17:14.19 Tony Fowler but is... i still don't quite believe it i guess It's like if I'm sitting here right now sometimes I'll get like tension. in that same spot and it's like Kind of at like the top where the calf.
01:17:27.64 Tony Fowler Kind of a. feels like it's attaching to like the knee. area that little muscle up there.
01:17:33.52 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
01:17:33.99 Tony Fowler Gets really tight. um And that's actually what I would have used. like ah If I was using like a Theragun or something like one of those. Ah.
01:17:44.93 Tony Fowler And I'll literally just tap it. 10 times. And it'll just whoo. the tension will just disappear.
01:17:51.43 Taylor Kruse Hmm.
01:17:51.71 Tony Fowler And sometimes I'll do like two sets of that or three sets. and it's a light tap. it's not even It's like almost like absent-minded.
01:17:57.13 Taylor Kruse on that area.
01:17:58.49 Tony Fowler It's just like dooo tu tu tu do yep. Um...
01:18:02.13 Taylor Kruse Hm.
01:18:02.67 Tony Fowler And you Taylor you had mentioned that. for something else and so i had just tried it and it still blows my mind. How that. is... Probably my most high payoff.
01:18:13.05 Tony Fowler for that specific feeling of tension.
01:18:13.31 Taylor Kruse See? Thanks. see So you don't have to spend 25 minutes. Smashing it.
01:18:19.100 Tony Fowler Well yeah Yeah.
01:18:21.15 Taylor Kruse Because...
01:18:22.16 Tony Fowler And actually. i had used my friend had gave given me a theragun so of course i was just using it all the time and specifically on this
01:18:29.00 Taylor Kruse Right.
01:18:30.54 Tony Fowler And it felt really good at first. And then one day. I like. overdid it and it ever since then if i was using it on that Spot. it would get worse.
01:18:40.60 Taylor Kruse Hmm.
01:18:40.98 Tony Fowler I'd feel more pain. It would get tighter. And so I just abandoned using that tool. all together. um I'd be curious how it would feel now. with the right dosage.
01:18:49.76 Taylor Kruse Sure. Sure.
01:18:51.67 Tony Fowler But yeah I felt like it was like a learned response in the wrong way. Um
01:18:56.48 Taylor Kruse Hmm.
01:18:57.23 Tony Fowler So yeah I'm curious what. what you might think about specifically the tapping if you could if you could even offer like a an explanation as to why that's so effective for me ah potentially.
01:19:08.82 Taylor Kruse Yeah. so Okay. So it's hard to say a hundred percent other than Well it's a sensory stimulus right and it and it's going to be specific to possibly a certain group of receptors.
01:19:23.19 Taylor Kruse So remember our eight levels model that we had talked about?
01:19:24.85 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:19:26.99 Taylor Kruse This would be the receptor level. So you're stimulating. nerve endings with a very specific type of stimulus. So that's one idea perhaps that specific stimulus is.
01:19:38.95 Taylor Kruse the one that your your brain is responding to. It's interesting though with tapping. it's So and it kind of depends on what you read but it also depends on where you're tapping.
01:19:49.70 Taylor Kruse because
01:19:50.43 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:19:51.00 Taylor Kruse you know each muscle has what would be. defined as like a motor point and I mean this opens up a whole can because there's more than just motor points in the body. This is you know more alicia's um you know thing with you know accu puncture points and stuff but keeping it simple.
01:20:12.45 Taylor Kruse um Sometimes... your tendency like intuitively is to want to go to the motor point of a muscle. when you're having a tension or a pain issue.
01:20:24.27 Taylor Kruse And... Again it depends on kind of what you read. but Tapping. a motor point oftentimes can inhibit the muscle.
01:20:35.72 Taylor Kruse to some degree. Especially if it's like rapid tapping.
01:20:39.87 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:20:40.09 Taylor Kruse It opened again. It's a little bit like. There may be some individual... you know some individuality to that. It's hard to say for sure. because I've also played around with just putting pressure on a motor point tractioning the skin back and forth pulling pulling the skin away from the motor point. You get different responses.
01:20:58.28 Taylor Kruse So it's hard to say for sure.
01:21:00.26 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:21:00.37 Taylor Kruse but it is entirely possible that maybe you are tapping a very specific like localized spot. just because that's where you're feeling your tension. And just through doing that you're...
01:21:11.36 Taylor Kruse you're you're changing muscle tone. that's what it is You're changing localized muscle tone.
01:21:13.32 Tony Fowler okay Yeah.
01:21:16.77 Taylor Kruse and And that muscle I think you're describing is probably the popliteus. Is it on the back of your knee?
01:21:22.48 Tony Fowler Uh yeah yeah. Sort of.
01:21:24.24 Taylor Kruse Yeah. the
01:21:24.43 Tony Fowler It's like right by the corner. Um. i'm gonna google it and see if if it looks right well how how would i spell that popliteus
01:21:30.88 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:21:33.63 Taylor Kruse Yeah. P-O-P-L-I T-E-U-S.
01:21:36.41 Tony Fowler It's like Latin.
01:21:38.18 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:21:39.61 Tony Fowler Small deep triangle.
01:21:39.96 Taylor Kruse See ya See what you think
01:21:42.04 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:21:42.96 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:21:43.77 Tony Fowler Uh... Yeah because it's on the outside side.
01:21:45.61 Taylor Kruse Yeah. That muscle is a bastard. What? It responds really well to tibial nerve glides. Have you tried tibial nerve glides?
01:21:54.64 Tony Fowler No I haven't
01:21:55.52 Taylor Kruse yeah so you can try to be that was my first thought even with the tapping because you're talking about the sensory distribution of the tibial nerve as well as the
01:22:03.63 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:22:03.86 Taylor Kruse Motor distribution. Anytime there's a ligamentous. um in injury to the knee it is very common for the popliteus you know this is a stability strategy for that the brain and nervous system uses is very common for the populate lydia's to become very tight feeling.
01:22:19.24 Tony Fowler right to protect it.
01:22:20.70 Taylor Kruse Yeah and it's a small angled muscle which makes it incredibly strong. If you think about like the the the fiber orientation of the Popliteus and the angle it makes it well... a great muscle to make tight When...
01:22:36.81 Taylor Kruse there might be a threat response happening somewhere else in the knee So a lot of times that chronic back of the knee tension that people get post knee injury or post knee surgery is very common after.
01:22:47.49 Taylor Kruse a pretty serious knee surgery and there's been scarring on the knee for the popliteus to become we might say like hyper facilitated. What that means is. The tone has changed.
01:22:58.98 Taylor Kruse And there's a reason for that. from a stability standpoint. So that's quite common. But that muscle can be... difficult to convince you know the nervous system to Hey stop.
01:23:10.97 Taylor Kruse Right? um And yeah. It's a common area.
01:23:15.83 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:23:16.80 Taylor Kruse Yeah the first thing I would try is a tibial nerve glide.
01:23:16.91 Tony Fowler Yeah fascinating.
01:23:19.22 Taylor Kruse And then I'm wondering which hand you're tapping with. And which...
01:23:21.72 Tony Fowler My right hand. Same side as yeah.
01:23:22.86 Taylor Kruse Right hand right knee. Okay. because I was just wondering if some complex movement. in your upper body at the same time would help with that but i'm not sure if that would do it or not
01:23:32.65 Tony Fowler Interesting. Interesting.
01:23:33.83 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:23:34.55 Tony Fowler So now we're talking about stacking.
01:23:36.62 Taylor Kruse yeah yeah so another thing to consider when we do manual inputs like that is the speed that you're tapping. might be telling you the speed that you should move. So for example if we do any kind of...
01:23:50.67 Taylor Kruse tissue work. on the body The type of tissue work that we do is working with the nervous system. you know we're not we're not digging into bodies and doing anything deep or anything like that.
01:24:01.35 Taylor Kruse That's just not what we do.
01:24:02.53 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:24:02.72 Taylor Kruse So if I'm if i'm putting my hand on the skin. I might pull the skin in different directions the eight cardinal directions of the compass and I'll test each direction to see okay what is the response here? Is the pain less? Is the movement better? And I might find a direction. where It's better.
01:24:19.54 Taylor Kruse So I might now start to get more specific in terms of the receptor type. So I might traction the skin and pulse it. So I might pulse the skin at end range of motion in that direction.
01:24:31.07 Taylor Kruse And I might pause. one pulse per second. and retest. Maybe that was okay but it wasn't great. And then I might pulse. Three times per second.
01:24:41.44 Taylor Kruse So now I'm increasing the frequency or the speed.
01:24:44.49 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:24:44.75 Taylor Kruse of the stimulus still pulsing into the high payoff direction that the Tissue you wanted to go And then finally I might be pulsing. It like. the fastest speed.
01:24:56.74 Taylor Kruse might be a little faster than that And... Usually what you'll find... is that from a receptor standpoint there is a speed That is highest payoff.
01:25:08.32 Taylor Kruse And and this is this can really bring the manual work to a whole other level. So then you would take that information you go. Okay so I can apply this stimulus With. My hand.
01:25:18.90 Taylor Kruse For sure. I can traction the. the skin I can... pulse it and maybe that's good. But. With all of the manual stuff that we do we typically like to then follow up with Creating Assisted Exercise that essentially does the same thing.
01:25:33.82 Taylor Kruse Because... the best way to create long-term results in the body. is to... Do it actively. So a passive stimulus is good. it's powerful. There's a place for this.
01:25:45.66 Taylor Kruse But. Eventually we can't expect that a passive stimulus like just pulling the skin in a desired direction is going to... Get the best result or. create a long-term result.
01:25:57.55 Taylor Kruse There's no motor activity that goes on with it. and brain The brain is responding to both motor and sensory inputs at the same time. So typically what we see is a of type of a passive stimulus is.
01:26:10.40 Taylor Kruse not as not as good compared to an active. So we create assisted exercise. right um the So maybe your assisted exercise for your knee is knee circles.
01:26:22.79 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:26:23.42 Taylor Kruse but Because you figured out a... tempo of tapping That is high payoff for you the next thing would be well what if we did the knee circles at that speed until if the tapping is rather fast.
01:26:38.55 Taylor Kruse You might just try because we don't know the exact speed necessarily but you might set a metronome. And you might. excuse me you might try to do the knee circle at that speed. And that might make the input more specific to the receptors.
01:26:53.64 Taylor Kruse that are responding From what you're doing with the tapping So it's it's really neat to experience that because the difference between doing the same exercise like that knee circle slow.
01:27:05.63 Taylor Kruse and controlled versus increasing the... the speed to let's say medium or fast. Even if you're... typically like with a knee circle. You're going to do it quickly. you're not going to be able to do it quickly with a large range of motion right you have to decrease the circle.
01:27:21.49 Taylor Kruse in order to achieve the speed
01:27:23.57 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:27:23.66 Taylor Kruse That's okay. That's okay. This is a different form of joint mobility. This is more we're trying to activate those receptors we're not necessarily as interested in.
01:27:27.80 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:27:34.42 Taylor Kruse the full range of motion. Okay so so then you play with speed and you retest and you see okay is this. a better way of using the same exercise that's been helpful.
01:27:45.96 Taylor Kruse But now we've added speed specificity to it. which makes it much more receptor specific. the result can be ridiculous.
01:27:53.66 Tony Fowler Interesting.
01:27:54.68 Taylor Kruse Yep.
01:27:54.92 Tony Fowler That's cool. I'm definitely going to have to try that and and report back.
01:27:58.33 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Yeah play with the speed.
01:27:59.23 Tony Fowler The...
01:27:59.51 Taylor Kruse And just keep it simple simple right? Slow speed. Test it. Medium speed just a little more continuous tempo. Fast speed. pretty much as quick as you can without the movement getting sloppy.
01:28:12.41 Tony Fowler Yeah I just landed on a speed. subconsciously I guess. Um but it's it's kind of fast it's kind of like that that that that that that that you know so
01:28:20.02 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
01:28:22.56 Tony Fowler We'll see if tiny knee circles. ah Do something. Um
01:28:26.76 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:28:27.93 Tony Fowler The other thing you're making me think about. Um... When you were talking about testing like the tractioning is when I was doing the banded supported Uh Knee circles.
01:28:39.20 Tony Fowler It was definitely tractioning in a specific direction.
01:28:39.62 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:28:42.81 Tony Fowler Um And... you know might be worth testing that and
01:28:48.95 Taylor Kruse Definitely. That direction matters.
01:28:49.86 Tony Fowler Trying some Kinesio tape. or something and
01:28:52.68 Taylor Kruse Yes. That direction matters especially with ligament.
01:28:53.74 Tony Fowler Yeah just.
01:28:56.73 Taylor Kruse injury. injury
01:28:58.42 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:28:58.56 Taylor Kruse Even if you know know the tissue trauma has been healed of course because you've... you know it's been a while but if you're still feeling a little something testing the direction Of the. pull coming from the band.
01:29:11.81 Taylor Kruse Very important. You can find a high payoff direction think about your compass test them all. But I think I may have. told you this once but it was in like a quick you know we didn't we didn't spend much time with it a very good tool
01:29:22.05 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:29:26.40 Taylor Kruse Four. ligament. Type injury. because ligaments are some of the most nose-susceptive tissue in the body. Which makes sense right? They have the most threat receptors Because...
01:29:39.94 Taylor Kruse Your brain wants to know if bones are being pulled apart. That's important for survival right
01:29:46.12 Tony Fowler Seems so yeah.
01:29:46.25 Taylor Kruse So... Yeah. So the problem is when and when a ligament has become injured. um For lack of a better way to describe it. It's almost like the nociception. becomes active in that area and stays active in that area even when tissue... Damage has been healed.
01:30:06.37 Taylor Kruse So that's why you can have a ligament that still expresses. Well you think the pain is the in the ligament right? It's still expressing the... the pain. And ligaments generally respond.
01:30:20.22 Taylor Kruse healed ligaments. Let me say this. healed ligaments generally respond extremely well to pressure. and torsion. Again this is receptor specific.
01:30:31.54 Taylor Kruse So a technique that can be used on joints. In your case when The tissue damage has been healed but you might still feel some instability or some pain whatever tension. Double band.
01:30:43.38 Taylor Kruse on the knee.
01:30:44.45 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:30:44.33 Taylor Kruse in your case which means One band. is below the knee pulling you in. one direction. The other band is slightly above the knee.
01:30:55.55 Taylor Kruse pulling you in a different direction. Your bands are either going to be 90 degrees to one another.
01:31:00.64 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:31:01.36 Taylor Kruse in terms of the vectors. or 180. And this creates... Torsion. a stronger torsion that's sensed at the joint. The 90 degree I would say is...
01:31:12.41 Tony Fowler Right it's like twisting.
01:31:13.80 Taylor Kruse Yes the 90 degree is probably the highest.
01:31:14.33 Tony Fowler Twisting at the joint. yeah
01:31:17.04 Taylor Kruse percentage I've seen be good. and it feels really good because the joint feels supported as you're doing it because you've got the Two different vectors going. And then you do the exercise and you just get a completely different load on the joint.
01:31:31.53 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:31:32.13 Taylor Kruse awesome for ligaments.
01:31:34.43 Tony Fowler fascinating fascinating.
01:31:35.65 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:31:36.19 Tony Fowler Yeah i'll definitely I'll definitely report back. Um... Shifting gears. i um I'm gonna bring this up Um but I'm not sure if it's like truly a high payoff drill.
01:31:48.59 Tony Fowler So I'm curious what you think. um because i haven't really tested it as such but when i'm when I'm doing focus work sometimes. I realize that humming like almost like an ohm like a mmm.
01:32:00.24 Tony Fowler Like something like that.
01:32:02.49 Taylor Kruse Sure.
01:32:03.37 Tony Fowler helps me focus. like incredibly well.
01:32:07.07 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:32:07.22 Tony Fowler um And I know from our conversations that that's like a parasympathetic. stimulus that like humming um And. potentially there's like a vibration thing going on and there's like potentially an auditory thing going on.
01:32:23.58 Tony Fowler Um So I'm curious. Ah. I actually want to test that with my knee now. and see if there's actually a A there there right?
01:32:36.47 Tony Fowler But I'm curious what you think about just like. like focus as a potential Assessment. and then also like what what might be going on with the humming
01:32:46.100 Taylor Kruse Do you have any thoughts on that? Well I'm just thinking it's a medullary stimulus so then I'm wondering what other kinds of medullary stimulus we could... test and see if it's high payoff as well and the first thing i'm thinking of is actually a vision drill
01:32:55.60 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:32:59.57 Taylor Kruse um horizontal smooth proceeds i Yeah. right more That would be... that would be more medullary horizontal smooth pursuit so just following your finger.
01:33:08.48 Tony Fowler Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
01:33:10.14 Taylor Kruse as a target from left to right a few times. Because it has such an impact on muscle tone I'm wondering if you tried that. first before doing the local work on your knee if that would give you a better result and you can hum at the same time yeah yeah you can hum at the same time vision drill
01:33:25.25 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:33:27.73 Taylor Kruse Yeah but it's it's hard to say so like humming like you said
01:33:27.82 Tony Fowler Fascinating.
01:33:31.36 Taylor Kruse we look at it as. Generally a more parasympathetic type of stimulus. um because of uh Well the vagus nerve. you know there's a big one there that's involved with humming because you're using the muscles in your throat
01:33:41.26 Tony Fowler who
01:33:45.92 Taylor Kruse you know and
01:33:46.09 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:33:46.100 Taylor Kruse um you know it's it's So it's a strong medullary stimulus. there's Other things. right going on there for sure it's hard to isolate any kind of stimulus Humming is very grounding.
01:33:59.59 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:33:59.77 Taylor Kruse It's very grounding. and Um You know anytime you're you're activating the vagus nerve. you know It is also still a strong cortical. stimulus uh specifically we'd be thinking about the insular cortex Yeah.
01:34:15.33 Taylor Kruse so
01:34:15.93 Tony Fowler Because you're thinking you're you're feeling something internal and you're you're focusing on something internal.
01:34:16.24 Taylor Kruse you know
01:34:20.25 Tony Fowler Is that kind of the connection there?
01:34:20.71 Taylor Kruse Yeah. That's part of it.
01:34:22.49 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:34:22.43 Taylor Kruse That's part of it. Also the vagus nerve. is kind of the information. uh highway to those internal sensations reaching the brain reaching the insular cortex um yeah so anytime you activate the vagus nerve you can't really separate it from.
01:34:40.66 Taylor Kruse from the insula. But that's interesting. You should use humming in your in your training and see what it does for you.
01:34:47.74 Tony Fowler Yeah. And just as ah as an assessment. is focus. potentially an assessment or is that
01:34:55.57 Taylor Kruse 100 % Mm hmm.
01:34:56.34 Tony Fowler Too tricky. Um
01:34:57.62 Taylor Kruse No. 100%.
01:34:58.51 Tony Fowler No.
01:34:58.93 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:34:59.06 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:34:59.63 Taylor Kruse Yeah you'd have to have... Well you don't have to. it's harder to Well...
01:35:05.92 Tony Fowler To measure perhaps?
01:35:06.75 Taylor Kruse It's harder to measure. It's harder to measure.
01:35:08.01 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:35:09.24 Taylor Kruse There might be a way to measure it. um you know It's... You can use anything you know reading comprehension. is an assessment. Right. I would use the juggling because it's such a multitasking. Yeah.
01:35:22.89 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:35:22.83 Taylor Kruse tool So I would use the juggling as a reassessment for that. Yep. Yeah.
01:35:28.16 Tony Fowler I got homework.
01:35:28.22 Taylor Kruse You can really use anything.
01:35:29.03 Tony Fowler I got stuff to try.
01:35:29.64 Taylor Kruse yeah Yeah. You can really use anything as an assessment really. That's what's so fun.
01:35:36.64 Tony Fowler Um as kind of like a final question I guess as we wrap up Have there been any... high payoff drills that you've experienced with yourselves or with clients that just still boggle the minds like any anything that was just so weird that it's worth mentioning just to Just to open up our... our our minds to possibilities.
01:36:01.56 Taylor Kruse Yeah. do um Well. This is more of this was something we learned a while ago for some reason it just popped in my head but the battery on the tongue Oh gosh I haven't thought about that in a while.
01:36:12.18 Tony Fowler Oh interesting.
01:36:14.16 Taylor Kruse I don't even remember the full story. I just remember you trying it and I can't remember what it even does. probably like so
01:36:19.09 Tony Fowler Well because you feel the...
01:36:20.57 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:36:20.68 Tony Fowler the electricity right and like that metallic Taste.
01:36:20.78 Taylor Kruse yeah Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a nine volt battery. Yeah. I've used it to stimulate the tongue. Um Like you did when you were a kid. you know like yeah i'm gonna touch this to my tongue ah you know and it gives you that little
01:36:35.68 Tony Fowler you You might be a sensory seeker Taylor.
01:36:35.77 Taylor Kruse That little zing. Yeah. Yeah I'm not necessarily recommending it. But. um It's a strong stimulus. I've played around with it. in you know in when we're using cranial nerves. and um it's a sensory stimulus on the tongue um So. depending on where you do it. But if tip of the tongue you know we might be thinking about trigeminal nerve and Yeah it's a funny one. let's see that
01:37:05.01 Taylor Kruse We haven't really really used that almost at all. It's been a while. Something we learned so long ago that I thought was hilarious. It's been a while. So. um but yeah weird stuff so one that is consistently giving great results that continues to just seem weird no matter how many times we experience it is bag breathing.
01:37:25.63 Taylor Kruse breathing into a bag. and essentially re-breathing your own CO2. Right. In fact I used this yesterday on a... uh session with our student.
01:37:37.49 Taylor Kruse And the result was excellent. It's just a really... fast way to increase co2 and thus get better circulation to the brain to the body. Because oxygen delivery improves.
01:37:50.24 Taylor Kruse with the increase of co2 That one. Has has given More? uh great results in a ton of different ways than a lot of other things and it just never gets old it's like this is so weird i've seen I've seen pain.
01:38:07.40 Taylor Kruse you know chronic pain of 10 years go away with two sets of bag breathing. Many times. I've seen headaches. Years of headaches post-concussion go away. Many times.
01:38:18.74 Taylor Kruse I have seen visual acuity jump five lines on a Snellen chart.
01:38:24.01 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:38:24.10 Taylor Kruse from breathing into a bag. Okay. It's... bizarre what can happen when you just increase circulation. That's a neat one. And actually we have a YouTube video.
01:38:35.26 Taylor Kruse I think we have a YouTube video. on bag breathing is that right yeah yeah yeah so if anyone wanted to check that out they can go to our youtube channel and learn about it there are some nuances that you want to know about with with bag breathing and But it's it's a neat one.
01:38:53.67 Taylor Kruse Was there any others? i was just thinking of um Corey when he... pop down the pinhole. lenses and his vision was like insanely better. Yeah Tony knows about pinhole lenses.
01:39:05.53 Taylor Kruse Because you you you have some right
01:39:05.60 Tony Fowler Yeah. Got some right right there. Yeah.
01:39:09.47 Taylor Kruse yeah we've seen a lot of interesting results from that
01:39:10.03 Tony Fowler Uh...
01:39:13.00 Tony Fowler So I have an interesting phenomenon. um Where. So I like to walk and talk. I'll pace around. when I'm talking on the phone.
01:39:20.87 Taylor Kruse Same here. Yeah he does too.
01:39:21.82 Tony Fowler And I find that like. kind of my eyes start to like glaze over
01:39:25.100 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm.
01:39:26.20 Tony Fowler And it's this weird thing. This is why I'm an audio engineer. history. history. uh note is like in in classes a lot of times teachers thought i wasn't paying attention because i was never looking at them i was just
01:39:39.26 Taylor Kruse Sure.
01:39:39.79 Tony Fowler listening and doodling or something. So they try to call me out and then i would I'd have the answer because I was i was listening. I was engaged.
01:39:46.81 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:39:47.13 Tony Fowler um But yeah so like walking on the phone and and I realized now that I've been. talking to you that it almost feels like putting blinders on a little bit like my it almost feels a little claustrophobic where like i'm i'm disengaging my eyes it's almost like tunnel vision a little bit it's not that dramatic but that's kind of the thing
01:40:01.99 Taylor Kruse Sure.
01:40:05.00 Tony Fowler And I find if I put. those pinhole glasses on. Juan. having these conversations on the phone. I just feel like my posture is a little better. I'm not like looking down.
01:40:13.62 Taylor Kruse That's interesting.
01:40:15.00 Tony Fowler So I think I have a visual deficit of some kind that isn't necessarily.
01:40:15.01 Taylor Kruse That's interesting.
01:40:19.09 Tony Fowler 100 % acuity. Related.
01:40:20.74 Taylor Kruse Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
01:40:21.91 Tony Fowler but the pinhole glasses i should have brought that up is is a thing that i've been using now in my day to day life.
01:40:22.71 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:40:27.11 Taylor Kruse Oh that's interesting.
01:40:28.24 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:40:28.47 Taylor Kruse Yeah that makes me think of the midbrain. especially when you mention tunnel vision. Because as as your sympathetics become... more active If it's a pretty intense.
01:40:39.46 Taylor Kruse you generally see more tunneling of the visual field. Versus Hmm. I call it dilation. of the visual field with your peripheral vision.
01:40:51.11 Taylor Kruse right The peripheral fields. Shrink And you become more.
01:40:56.16 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:40:56.25 Taylor Kruse focused on what's in front of you. This is... typically what happens during uh intense. um activity of some kind. It could be...
01:41:07.23 Taylor Kruse Sport? But it also could be. You're... Saving somebody's life. right the the nervous system's response during High sympathetics is to tunnel the vision so that you can deal with the task at hand that's right in front of you.
01:41:24.60 Taylor Kruse So... It's interesting that you mentioned pinholes because... The pinhole lenses are a pretty strong. midbrain stimulus. Depends on how you look at it. we We usually start. looking at it as an inhibition tool.
01:41:39.30 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:41:39.84 Taylor Kruse So if the midbrain is too active let's say we might put pinholes on somebody and sort of just think about it as balancing. things out a little bit So that's that's interesting that by wearing the pinholes...
01:41:53.57 Taylor Kruse You got a good response there. Um the um peripheral field. is like this the fancy term or it's known as the ambient system of vision And that is actually very much driven by the midbrain too.
01:42:10.61 Taylor Kruse So... It's... It's actually an assessment which is kind of neat. we don't We don't use it too much. I don't teach it too much anymore. But if you wanted to you could actually test your own peripheral vision.
01:42:24.81 Taylor Kruse and use it. as an indicator let's say maybe during your training the more your vision starts to tunnel. the more sympathetic you're becoming. the more dilated it stays.
01:42:36.23 Taylor Kruse the more imbalance you're staying.
01:42:38.73 Tony Fowler Yeah. I wonder if tunnel. is is The right word. um Cause it's not actually that like I feel like the visions. like like they're getting black edges moving in or anything it's like uh
01:42:50.75 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:42:52.43 Tony Fowler Feels like my eyes just don't focus. I like look down and... and It's almost like they they glaze over a little bit.
01:42:58.38 Taylor Kruse Hmm.
01:42:58.35 Tony Fowler Um... But yeah. Yeah pinholes pinholes help. And pinholes reduce light right? But they also change...
01:43:04.42 Taylor Kruse Yes
01:43:05.30 Tony Fowler the direction that the light's coming in right it's more direct versus
01:43:07.29 Taylor Kruse Yes yeah. Yeah.
01:43:10.01 Tony Fowler coming from the side from the periphery.
01:43:12.55 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Yeah. a simple way to look at it is sort of like the aperture
01:43:16.73 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:43:17.04 Taylor Kruse changes you know in terms of how much light is being let in but also what you're describing too like sometimes when you're in the you're You're engaged in something. like speaking or You're looking at a screen. Your your blink rate reduces too.
01:43:32.09 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:43:32.68 Taylor Kruse And if your blink rate reduces Enough. You can get some... weird kind of glazed over even dry eyes that kind of thing sometimes can be
01:43:41.55 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:43:42.56 Taylor Kruse involved too. I'm thinking more. If you're responding to inhibition type tools for the midbrain another way to inhibit the midbrain is to activate the frontal lobe.
01:43:53.78 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:43:54.36 Taylor Kruse And so you can do some of the go no go or.
01:43:57.60 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:43:57.50 Taylor Kruse anti-psychotic things that we talked about earlier and see if you respond well to that. Let's go right back to your juggling too.
01:44:01.55 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
01:44:02.88 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:44:03.37 Tony Fowler while i'm on the well I got the headset phone so I can do that.
01:44:04.01 Taylor Kruse That's a good.
01:44:06.79 Taylor Kruse Yeah. that's a good That's a good frontal lobe stimulus.
01:44:12.06 Tony Fowler Very cool um Yeah this is this was a really fascinating episode and I feel like it was a really... um Kind of nuts and bolts Rubber to the road.
01:44:25.09 Tony Fowler uh episode as opposed to just staying in the theory you know we
01:44:26.60 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Yeah yeah this is nice
01:44:28.96 Tony Fowler We had a lot of examples here that people I think can. try out or relate to or... you know learn from right.
01:44:35.79 Taylor Kruse Yeah it's great. Let's see. So what do we normally I ask Alicia before I get on every podcast? Hey what should I tell them at the end? So what should I tell them at the end?
01:44:46.04 Taylor Kruse We get a lot of questions about when they can people can join the courses or when we're going to have our next live masterclass. And we're not actually going to be doing that until early. in the new year.
01:44:57.14 Taylor Kruse um
01:44:57.39 Tony Fowler Okay.
01:44:58.80 Taylor Kruse So I think the best thing to do I've been telling everybody to listen to the podcast but since we're already here. Um then the best thing to do would be to get on the wait list. There is a small chance that we'll run a waitlist enrollment during this fall. It's going to depend on my capacity.
01:45:14.94 Tony Fowler Sure.
01:45:15.42 Taylor Kruse to do that. um But there's a lot of people who want a self-paced version so they can get in now. I am considering it. So in order to be notified you'll have to be on the wait list for the neuro foundations.
01:45:26.80 Taylor Kruse um But then the next chance to go live is going to be in the. Probably the end of January.
01:45:34.41 Tony Fowler Yeah. Very cool.
01:45:36.61 Taylor Kruse Well there it is everybody. You you heard it from... The CEO Of when it's all going down. Thank you everybody for... tuning in and listening.
01:45:47.61 Taylor Kruse we really appreciate it if you haven't done so already if you could head on over to give us a review. That would be awesome. It really goes a long way. That's it for today. We'll be back soon.
