Timestamp Speaker Transcript
00:00:01.40 Tony Fowler And we're rolling.
00:00:03.70 Taylor Kruse Welcome back to the Cruise Elite Podcast. What's up, Tony?
00:00:07.26 Tony Fowler Good morning, Taylor. Good morning, Taylor. I have a question for you that's gonna seem random.
00:00:12.54 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:00:16.24 Tony Fowler When's the last time you've been on a trampoline?
00:00:19.38 Taylor Kruse Hmm, well actually not that long ago because every, well, not it not currently, but not in the past maybe two or three weeks, but most Fridays are actually gymnastics day days for my five-year-old.
00:00:22.04 Tony Fowler Really?
00:00:35.70 Tony Fowler Yeah, right?
00:00:36.57 Taylor Kruse And my wife and I will alternate who takes her over there. And so, you know, I gotta to get on the equipment myself So yeah, I'm on a trampoline once in a while, you know just kind of playing around and teaching my daughter how to navigate what is a very dangerous piece of equipment when you're five.
00:00:57.05 Tony Fowler yeah right
00:00:57.85 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:00:59.29 Tony Fowler I mean, you can just go flying.
00:00:59.38 Taylor Kruse Yep.
00:01:00.57 Tony Fowler So i recently was visiting our our mutual friend, Jordan, and he has a trampoline in the backyard.
00:01:05.33 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:01:07.80 Taylor Kruse Sure.
00:01:08.76 Tony Fowler And we got on there. Man, I was not.
00:01:14.20 Tony Fowler How do I put this? It had been so long since I'd been on a trampoline.
00:01:17.43 Taylor Kruse Right.
00:01:17.88 Tony Fowler i just like wasn't um prepared for how it was going to feel.
00:01:22.58 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:01:23.32 Tony Fowler um And, you know, it kind of felt like my knees were almost jelly for a little bit.
00:01:24.09 Taylor Kruse Yep.
00:01:28.01 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:01:28.41 Tony Fowler And then you get the hang of it and you're like kind of moving with the the up and down. And then when you get off, all of a sudden it felt like my legs were like lead because there was no bounce whatsoever. And my my body had already gotten used to like just that that extreme rebound, right?
00:01:45.05 Taylor Kruse was it ah Did you have the sensory mismatch when you got off at all? like Did you get on hard ground and go, whoa?
00:01:48.06 Tony Fowler Yeah, it's like getting off the treadmill. It's like getting off the treadmill after a long time and all of a sudden walking on normal ground just feels wrong.
00:01:52.70 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah.
00:01:55.02 Tony Fowler It was like that.
00:01:55.77 Taylor Kruse yeah Yeah, that's sensory mismatch.
00:01:55.90 Tony Fowler It was like, okay.
00:01:57.85 Taylor Kruse that's Yeah, that's that's that's an example of a a kind of sensory mismatch.
00:02:03.11 Tony Fowler Yeah, it's fascinating, fascinating.
00:02:04.66 Taylor Kruse Yeah, where you like adapt you know you adapt to a certain you know environment or piece of equipment. you know Same thing happens when you're on a boat for the day.
00:02:15.24 Tony Fowler Right.
00:02:15.61 Taylor Kruse you know i've i've been I don't go on boats very often. And you know on occasion, you know I'll go fly fishing or something in the salt water and be on a boat for a day, and then I get off the boat.
00:02:23.96 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:02:26.92 Taylor Kruse I'm like, whoa, it's like walking feels strange, like I'm still rocking on the boat.
00:02:31.62 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:02:32.06 Taylor Kruse Yeah, same same idea.
00:02:33.70 Tony Fowler I've heard of that. like ah Some people don't get seasick, they get land sick.
00:02:37.44 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:02:37.74 Tony Fowler They get it when they get back, which is pretty fascinating.
00:02:39.38 Taylor Kruse Sure. Yeah, but tramps are, they can be tough. Like, yeah, when especially when you're not used to it.
00:02:47.64 Tony Fowler I was thinking, like if if you just did that every day a little bit, like A, like it's good for cardio. like Your heart rate goes up. There's obviously a lot of circulation going on.
00:02:58.17 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:02:58.68 Tony Fowler But also, it's like, how often are people really jumping and and not even just jumping, but like ah that shock absorption, even though it's a trampoline, like when you're landing, like you're ah bracing and absorbing.
00:03:11.52 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm. You're absorbing a lot. Yeah, yeah.
00:03:14.52 Tony Fowler Yeah, you're absorbing a lot of that that energy. um I feel like that would be like a nice novel stimulus for a lot of people.
00:03:23.35 Taylor Kruse It is, but it then it's also like there's sort of two there's two sides of it, right? there's There's the novel stimulus, which is good. There's the fact that it's fun.
00:03:34.58 Tony Fowler Yeah. Mm-hmm.
00:03:35.74 Taylor Kruse It's a very strong vestibular stimulus in some cases, depending on how you're jumping. in you know You get a new movement experience right where you're going higher than you have before. and you know It's fun to play around with different tricks and stuff. Certainly value you know in those departments.
00:03:55.10 Taylor Kruse But the as a training stimulus, you know if you're trying to get more serious about a training stimulus. It is a completely nonspecific environment, you know um almost like an unstable surface.
00:04:06.80 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:04:10.65 Taylor Kruse you know um
00:04:10.87 Tony Fowler the
00:04:12.41 Taylor Kruse So yeah, I just kind of i guess it's just depends you know it just depends. It just depends on what you want to do. I have chose a trampoline in in the past as a training stimulus for some of the Alpine ski racers that I worked with.
00:04:26.14 Tony Fowler cra
00:04:27.10 Taylor Kruse in some real specific ways because there' there's a way to jump on a trampoline. There's kind of two basic ways. you can You can jump on a trampoline and you can allow your body all that vertical movement where your head is actually moving through space with your body, right? That that verticality as you bounce.
00:04:49.40 Taylor Kruse But then there's another way to jump on a trampoline where Your lower body is active as you put force into the trampoline and the trampoline puts force back in you, but you stop your verticality and your head stays in place.
00:05:05.82 Taylor Kruse Very um unique thing that is very difficult to replicate on land. i'm Sure, you can do it, but it's it's more difficult. And so with some of the ski racers I've worked with in the past, i I had set up certain training drills for that reason, because they often have to get good at moving their body under their head very quickly without changing levels.
00:05:32.92 Tony Fowler Yep.
00:05:33.37 Taylor Kruse Yeah, kind of unique in that way.
00:05:33.38 Tony Fowler Yep. It's going over little bumps and, and,
00:05:35.35 Taylor Kruse yeah Yeah, right, right. So, yeah, it just kind of depends on how you how you want to use it. maybe we'll Maybe it'll come up in our conversation today, actually.
00:05:44.82 Tony Fowler Oh, interesting. OK.
00:05:45.75 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah, because, well, we're talking about the lymphatic system. And... and some Some of the you know marketing and stuff out there says, you know jump on a trampoline for the lymphatics you know and buy a rebounder.
00:06:00.02 Tony Fowler Interesting.
00:06:00.37 Taylor Kruse And yeah, that's one of the one of the things you hear anyway.
00:06:01.14 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:06:05.62 Tony Fowler So um I was wondering, is there any like neural pathway for like shock absorption? Because I feel like that's kind of a unique.
00:06:18.62 Tony Fowler Mm
00:06:18.74 Taylor Kruse Yeah, it's it's not an isolated thing, but when when so when you say shock absorption, lots of several things come to mind.
00:06:30.04 Taylor Kruse So you you have to have a good vestibular system.
00:06:30.13 Tony Fowler hmm.
00:06:36.06 Taylor Kruse Okay, and your your vestibular system is some of your main descending postural control during movement. So ah a difficulty, like a problem in the vestibular system or deconditioning in the vestibular system will make jumping and landing more difficult.
00:06:54.57 Tony Fowler Right.
00:06:55.24 Taylor Kruse There's no question. So shock absorption and putting force into the ground might be harder for somebody that has vestibular challenges. I also think about the cerebellum because of the accuracy and kind of fine tuning that has to happen proprioceptively.
00:07:13.69 Taylor Kruse When you're striking the ground very precisely, putting force into it, receiving energy back from the ground and in absorbing force, transferring force, you know the cerebellum is going to be a system that we would that we would think about for the accuracy of that and balance and the coordination of that.
00:07:35.45 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:07:36.60 Taylor Kruse And I think about tendons you know a lot, you know how how well your tendons can absorb force and and act like the shocks that they're supposed to be.
00:07:48.97 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:07:49.24 Taylor Kruse So thinking about deep tendon reflexes, the reflex arc with the spinal cord, lot of, this is actually something that I'm, I'm very, it's it's fascinating to me because there's actually like a movement happening, I think anyways, in the health and fitness world where people are talking a lot about tendons.
00:08:10.39 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:08:11.26 Taylor Kruse They're talking about connective tissue and the transfer of force and plyometrics and all that stuff. But I've never heard anyone talk about tendon reflexes. Like, never.
00:08:22.04 Taylor Kruse um And it's it's so interesting to me because it's it's literally a built-in shock absorber for us. and your tendons have to, that reflex, I should say, has to work properly.
00:08:38.52 Taylor Kruse And sometimes the tendons aren't responding the way they need to, especially with people that have had spinal cord ah injuries in their history. Sometimes those tendon reflexes are not working appropriately or different different problems, even at the cerebellar level, can cause
00:08:47.54 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:08:56.89 Taylor Kruse accuracy issues with how the tendon is responding to impact. you know So there's a lot there's a lot there. But those are those are things that come to mind with shock absorption and midline stability is a huge one, right? And we could talk about midline stability.
00:09:16.47 Taylor Kruse So you know there's so many things that go into that. But if your midline is not stable, then producing force, putting force into the ground or receiving force is unbelievably difficult, you know?
00:09:32.47 Tony Fowler So on the flip side, i guess you could make an argument that trampoline, like getting on a trampoline, could be vestibular training. It could be cerebellar training.
00:09:44.66 Tony Fowler It could help with kind of getting those signals to and from the brain if if it's something you haven't done ah much of.
00:09:51.99 Taylor Kruse yes it it Yes, but I look at it as a manipulation and using a tool to achieve a goal that you might feel is necessary now, but yeah it's again, it's a non-specific stimulus to the rest of what we're doing in life.
00:10:15.77 Taylor Kruse So sometimes we make training decisions knowing that it's not... ideal for possibly transferring as well as something else could.
00:10:25.98 Tony Fowler Sure, like water training or um even like compression band stuff where it's like you're not going to have that forever.
00:10:26.46 Taylor Kruse But we're... yeah Totally. Yep.
00:10:32.18 Taylor Kruse Yeah, there's... Right, right. So sometimes we make training decisions where we're like, okay, let's let's see how much we can squeeze out of this right now for this goal.
00:10:43.61 Taylor Kruse And... you know It's probably something we're going to graduate from, but we're using it for a reason. Like you said, when I when i did a lot more aquatic exercise work with people, the the water is nonspecific. i mean and it's and it's that The buoyancy that's involved in the water is totally nonspecific to how we control our body when when we're on land fighting gravity.
00:11:11.10 Taylor Kruse But we made training decisions to use the medium of water for specific reasons. And it can be a little bit, little small percentage of what you're doing. can be something you graduate from. But yeah, sometimes tools, sometimes those nonspecific tools can offer us something.
00:11:29.05 Taylor Kruse So yeah, you could you could make the argument. um And then there's just like the fun factor. You know, in the exposure, people say to me all the time, hey, you said don't use unstable surfaces for balance training.
00:11:42.41 Taylor Kruse It's like, well, like i probably at some point used to be more extreme about about that. My statement probably sounded more extreme. Now I'm just kind of like, well, there's a better way to do it if balance is your goal.
00:11:56.43 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:11:56.60 Taylor Kruse But the fun factor is okay, too.
00:11:56.62 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:11:59.61 Taylor Kruse you know You can still use unstable surfaces and its exposure to a unique training stimulus. But again, like we have to know we have to know and be aware of how how effective is it? How much can we expect to gain from it? When is it appropriate to graduate from it?
00:12:22.67 Tony Fowler Yeah. Fascinating. Now you've got me thinking about my AirX pad. I love getting on that thing and just kind of, yeah, just kind of doing single leg whatever on it.
00:12:28.47 Taylor Kruse Oh, do you?
00:12:31.70 Tony Fowler and
00:12:32.13 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:12:33.22 Tony Fowler it's just It's just fun, like you said. Or sometimes I'll actually use it, like I'll jump onto it just because...
00:12:38.87 Taylor Kruse Yep.
00:12:39.02 Tony Fowler I'm in like a hard concrete floor basement, you know, some some shock absorption is nice.
00:12:41.55 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Sure. Sure.
00:12:46.07 Tony Fowler But yeah, i think I think I'm not overthinking it. I'm not like programming with it so much. I'm just it's just there and it's fun sometimes, you know.
00:12:52.47 Taylor Kruse Right. Yeah, it's ah it's a reasonable proprioceptive tool. It's, ah yeah, again, it's stuff like that is not, I think sometimes people, they mistakenly associate it with balance because when you're on it, you feel unstable, right? And um it's it can be a proprioceptive tool more than a balance tool just because when you're when you're on any kind of unstable surface like that,
00:13:24.47 Taylor Kruse What generally happens is your joints and muscles become active as they respond to the lack of stability in the surface. And so that's all that little micro movement that you're feeling when you're on the the pad.
00:13:38.23 Taylor Kruse But what happens is your head stabilizes in place. So, and that in itself is kind of a reflexive response where now your body's moving underneath your head, but your head is remaining stable and it decreases input to the inner ear, to the vestibular system, because the semicircular canals sense linear accelerations in head and neck movement.
00:14:06.58 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:14:06.97 Taylor Kruse And when you get on an unstable surface, you do not go through the natural canal movements that might happen if you were on a stable surface and you were being perturbed or, you know, in some way or losing your balance, your head and neck would be more responsive.
00:14:27.70 Taylor Kruse Whereas when you're on the unstable surface, it's body under head, right? So it's just not as specific to balance as we might think, or we would just look at it as incomplete.
00:14:39.77 Tony Fowler Yeah, i I'm obviously not the expert here. But um whenever whenever we talk about this, I always think about the fact that there might be like some micro adjustments that your vestibular system is is getting or is is directing, right?
00:14:59.61 Tony Fowler Like even though your head's mostly stable, right?
00:14:59.93 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:15:02.68 Tony Fowler It has to stay stable and you have to tell your body what to do to stay stable. So maybe it's like a, like you said, partial, like a partial stimulus as opposed to.
00:15:06.99 Taylor Kruse Yep.
00:15:11.16 Taylor Kruse Yeah, mm-hmm. It's a reflex, so it's more on the category of what is called a vestibulocolic reflex, where the circuitry is helping to stabilize your neck.
00:15:21.13 Tony Fowler Mm hmm.
00:15:27.29 Taylor Kruse and in really the rest of your spine underneath your head. And there's also some vestibulospinal activity there. That's another reflex because as your body is moving underneath the head, you do have to recover its position, right?
00:15:45.50 Taylor Kruse You're you're still working to recover posture, essentially.
00:15:48.86 Tony Fowler who
00:15:49.98 Taylor Kruse Yeah, so it's not completely taken out of the equation. It's not.
00:15:52.57 Tony Fowler who
00:15:53.20 Taylor Kruse It's just that primarily... if we're checking all the boxes for balance training, the initial prerequisites are move the head, neck, and eyes. right So that's those are the pieces that get left out.
00:16:08.19 Tony Fowler Yep. Yep.
00:16:09.34 Taylor Kruse who
00:16:10.71 Tony Fowler So this is our episode on trampolines. um
00:16:13.18 Taylor Kruse yeah
00:16:15.58 Tony Fowler But our actual episode topic, like you alluded to earlier, is about the lymphatic system.
00:16:22.07 Taylor Kruse Right.
00:16:22.62 Tony Fowler And...
00:16:22.68 Taylor Kruse This one's been, this has been on tap for a while. We just haven't made it to this.
00:16:27.29 Tony Fowler Yeah, I've been I've been agitating for this for a minute.
00:16:27.83 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:16:30.05 Tony Fowler and you know, the reason why i really wanted to talk about this was I got sick. i don't know if it was like a year ago or something. And I was telling you, i was like, man, like my calves got real tight and like I feel better, but like my calves are super tight.
00:16:43.10 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:16:45.98 Tony Fowler And that's like if they're almost like sore. And I was just like, this is this is new and different for me from like ah from getting sick.
00:16:48.60 Taylor Kruse Right.
00:16:54.14 Tony Fowler And you're like, hey, man, you know, you should try. And you sent me a video of of like a lymphatic drainage technique.
00:16:57.53 Taylor Kruse who
00:17:02.42 Taylor Kruse Right, right.
00:17:03.67 Tony Fowler And it was just something I had never even thought about or considered before, I guess. The only thing I really knew about like the lymph nodes and stuff was you know like right under the the like corner of your jaw, like up almost by on your neck towards your ear, there's like a i don't know like a little ball in there.
00:17:19.16 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:17:28.47 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:17:29.27 Tony Fowler And sometimes it gets inflamed, right? like Sometimes you can feel it or see it more.
00:17:32.57 Taylor Kruse Yeah, that's a that's right. That's a cluster of lymph nodes.
00:17:35.99 Tony Fowler There you go. And so I had i had known about that and I'd actually like massage those before in the past, but I had never really thought about like, oh, this is increasing drainage or or anything really.
00:17:36.73 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Mm-hmm.
00:17:47.95 Tony Fowler And so I know this might be adjacent to applied neurology, but you seem to know something about this.
00:17:48.44 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:17:55.14 Tony Fowler And I thought it'd be really cool to explore this because it does seem like a technique that you have embraced and use in your own, you know, in your own life, right?
00:18:04.02 Taylor Kruse For sure. Yeah, for sure. um it's ah It's an interesting conversation and topic, something I feel like I'm learning about um a little bit at a time, all the time.
00:18:17.70 Taylor Kruse It's actually really gaining a lot of popularity, too.
00:18:21.29 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:18:21.41 Taylor Kruse People are talking more about it. It used to be that nobody talked about it beyond what you just said. Like, hey, you got a cold? You know, oh they, yep, they feel swollen. You know, you do have a cold. Your body's working hard against that cold. And, you know, everyone's, most people anyway, have had that experience where they feel underneath the, you know, the line of their, the corner of their jaw and they feel the the swelling that can take place there. And there's lymph nodes all over the body that are involved in, um,
00:18:51.19 Taylor Kruse in some interesting processes. So maybe we start with kind of a basic rundown of what the lymph system is, you know, and what it does for us.
00:18:57.41 Tony Fowler Sure.
00:18:58.77 Taylor Kruse And um hopefully that'll, you know, we'll find our way right into some applications, some practical things, actually, some very easy things to execute that that can be that can be quite useful for working with lymphatics.
00:19:13.88 Taylor Kruse so I guess the first thing, this might be completely new for some of our listeners, is to hear about the lymphatic system. So first thing that you want to know about lymphatics is that it is part of the circulatory system.
00:19:27.32 Taylor Kruse And essentially, the lymphatic system returns excess fluid back into circulation. So in other words, it helps with swelling.
00:19:38.71 Taylor Kruse So when you have an acute injury, and let's say you sprain your ankle, and your ankle swells up like a baseball, you know eventually your body's able to do something with that fluid, right? And it's your lymph system that is very much responding to the inflammation and over time helping to move the the excess fluid there.
00:20:02.30 Taylor Kruse So it's primarily like, you can think about it as like a plumbing system or like a sewer system for the body, right? um And it's... ah Think about it like a sewer system is actually a good it's a good way to look at it because one of the other things that's so important is that the lymph system helps to aid in immune function and the destruction of waste and debris and infectious agents and even cancer cells.
00:20:34.46 Taylor Kruse right So it's it's the plumbing system that's helping to get the bad guys out, basically. Lymph is filtered through lymph nodes.
00:20:46.30 Taylor Kruse um it's It's filtered through vessels and in other lymphatic organs as it flows back towards reentry into the venous system. So it's it's it's the circular it's working with the circulatory system.
00:20:59.46 Taylor Kruse You can't separate it from blood, basically, right?
00:21:02.59 Tony Fowler Okay. okay
00:21:04.41 Taylor Kruse Yeah, ah it goes through this filtering process that hopefully if the process is working well, it kills and removes the bad guys, the pathogens and debris.
00:21:15.00 Taylor Kruse and And here's an interesting one. The lymph system helps to absorb and transport fats and fat-soluble vitamins like a D, E, and K, which is just you know an interesting thing to know about it.
00:21:32.82 Tony Fowler Yeah, yeah.
00:21:34.26 Taylor Kruse And it brings up some you know thoughts or questions about people that have difficulty with their lymph system who might also be seeing deficiencies in in vitamins, yeah, in these fat-soluble vitamins.
00:21:51.00 Tony Fowler Sure. Yeah.
00:21:54.36 Taylor Kruse So as far as the anatomy goes, so we've got lymph fluid, okay? And then we have lymph vessels that are very close to the surface of the skin. So what I would encourage our listeners to do is just quickly Google up a picture of the lymphatic system, and and you'll get head-to-toe image that usually has green lines all over it, almost like the green lines look like nerves or meridian pathways, however you want to think about it, but they're everywhere.
00:22:27.93 Taylor Kruse right so You can really see like how global the lymph system is. um Those green lines are the vessels, right? And they're really close to the skin. So, you know, most of the lymphatic system is very close to the dermal layer of skin, which is good to know because a lot of the manual therapies or manual techniques that we might use to help mobilize the lymph system
00:23:00.25 Taylor Kruse well, the lymph system is incredibly accessible because you don't have to go digging very deep in order to affect it, which is nice.
00:23:03.92 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:23:08.81 Taylor Kruse you know Those vessels are close to the the surface of the skin. So we've got we've got those vessels. We've got lymph nodes, like you described, around you know the cervical area, corner of the jaw.
00:23:21.22 Taylor Kruse That's you know that's a lymph node area. There are clusters. there There are areas around the whole body that have... high concentrations of you know these clusters of lymph nodes. So another place where you might be able to easily palpate them is actually in your hip creases, like the groin crease.
00:23:42.68 Taylor Kruse um over like the inguinal ligament. And so kind of where if if you like feel around in your hip creases where things are pretty bony and you can, you know, with your fingertips kind of pressing into your groin crease, um there's not a lot of like, you know, protective tissue there, right? You immediately start, you know, rolling over all sorts of anatomy.
00:24:04.86 Taylor Kruse um And if you feel around, eventually what you're going to feel are lymph nodes. right Again, those kind of little circular um you know little circular shaped that you know nodes in there that feel like a little kidney bean or something, if you know what I mean.
00:24:22.77 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:24:23.64 Taylor Kruse And um beyond that, we also have lymph organs. So we have you know major organs like the the ones that are talked about a lot in relation to the lymphatic system is the thymus and the spleen. And and those organs are...
00:24:38.20 Taylor Kruse very much involved in this filtering of blood. And they also help to create white blood cells you know in their filtering process, which also aid in our immune function. So yeah, lots of interesting little key things about anatomy. And um you know to keep it super simple, think about it as the sewer system.
00:25:00.76 Taylor Kruse And we want to make sure that that plumbing is working efficiently. We want to make sure that it's not clogged or become stagnant, which It can. this the The lymphatic system has an optimal functioning, and and sometimes it can become stagnant.
00:25:21.82 Taylor Kruse Sometimes they are or that stagnation is related to local factors where we might need to figure out where a stagnant area is and do something about it. Other times, the whole lymphatic system globally can actually become stagnant.
00:25:41.89 Taylor Kruse stagnant from different states of our, you know, health and and body that can that can occur. So we'll probably talk about some of that stuff and, you know, at some point here as we get into, you know, why why work on the lymph system and how.
00:25:58.81 Tony Fowler okay um Immediately, like two kind of neuro things come to mind, right? If we're at the dermal layer, we know that there's other receptors at that level.
00:26:09.68 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
00:26:13.37 Taylor Kruse Yes.
00:26:14.23 Tony Fowler um And so I wonder if if beyond just like physically, like almost like pushing the the fluids in the lymph system you know manually.
00:26:29.59 Tony Fowler Beyond that, if there's a a neurological stimulus that might help activate the lymph system, I don't know. I'm asking. And then, well, let's let's start there.
00:26:37.18 Taylor Kruse yep
00:26:38.81 Tony Fowler What do you think about that?
00:26:39.99 Taylor Kruse ah Yeah. I mean, here's the thing about lymph, you know, lymph fluid. Everything, all movement is designed to affect it.
00:26:50.69 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:26:51.03 Taylor Kruse Right. So it's it's very as we start to, like, become educated on the lymph system. Right. Humans have this amazing ability to reverse engineer things and isolate things down to.
00:27:02.71 Taylor Kruse such a level that we start feeling like the lymph system is just one system. it doesn't interact with other systems, and and that's not the case.
00:27:11.20 Tony Fowler Right.
00:27:12.21 Taylor Kruse It's interacting with everything. it is It is not separate from the nervous system per se, and like I said, it's not separate from your blood. um So it's it's kind of human nature to start to think about it in such an isolated way where we we think that certain things or only certain things can help to mobilize it when the fact is there's so many things that have the ability to affect it.
00:27:41.30 Taylor Kruse So anytime you touch the body or a stimulus touches you, there's going to be a lot of um neurologic factors there in terms of sensing it and activating receptors as you're
00:27:41.75 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:27:56.15 Taylor Kruse as you're talking about, but the the touch itself, anytime you touch the body with ah a reasonable amount of pressure, you're creating pressure differential in the body.
00:28:15.29 Taylor Kruse And and that's it's important to know that because it means that any stimulus has the ability, any tactile stimulus has the ability to affect lymph.
00:28:26.78 Taylor Kruse you know? So ah anytime we press on the body, anytime we use things like kinesio tape is actually, um, one of the, uh, tools that can be used to affect the lymph system.
00:28:40.42 Taylor Kruse Again, because putting something on the skin, we're moving the skin, maybe combining that with movement, you know, of some kind.
00:28:41.01 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:28:49.66 Taylor Kruse And, uh, that's going to create pressure differential in the body, and the whole body technically responds to a localized pressure differential.
00:29:02.33 Taylor Kruse And that's why going like deeper into the lymph system, the other thing our listeners can kind of Google up here is a map of lymphatic drainage, because you can actually get pretty familiar with the direction of drainage um and even side-to-side differences with like global drainage, which I'm sure we'll talk about, actually, because it is an important detail when you're starting to use tactile techniques that mobilize the lymph system.
00:29:35.45 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:29:38.61 Taylor Kruse Knowing where to do that matters because the way things are designed is that Touching certain areas have the ability to impact, you know, either the right side of the body or the left side of the body.
00:29:52.82 Taylor Kruse So we'll we'll probably cover that. So, yeah, it's all, there's so many things that affect it. All movement, all touch. Breathing is a huge one. Yeah.
00:30:04.31 Tony Fowler Yeah, and then I was just going to say, yeah, and I was just going to say you mentioned it's it's tied to the blood you know blood system, cardiovascular system, right?
00:30:04.44 Taylor Kruse and And that makes sense, right, by design.
00:30:12.10 Taylor Kruse Right.
00:30:12.81 Tony Fowler So I was even just thinking like getting some cardio in may might mobilize stuff, right?
00:30:16.95 Taylor Kruse Oh, that's top so top of my list.
00:30:20.09 Tony Fowler Okay, okay.
00:30:20.44 Taylor Kruse Top of my list on techniques. Yeah.
00:30:23.38 Tony Fowler Well, let's let's run through them.
00:30:23.45 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:30:24.58 Tony Fowler You've you've got them queued up here.
00:30:25.98 Taylor Kruse Yeah, so... there's um there's some There's some that come to mind sooner than then other things. So top of the list is cardiovascular exercise.
00:30:39.26 Taylor Kruse I typically like to do this in more of a CO2 tolerance way, so also breathing. But you know you people have heard me talk about this a lot now, nasal breathing cardiovascular exercise.
00:30:55.26 Taylor Kruse where you're exerting yourself in some way, could be walking, running, hiking, cycling, any cardio really exercise that you want, and you are focusing on only breathing through your nose, and you're letting the nasal breathing, or your ability to sustain nasal breathing, set the intensity for what you're doing.
00:31:19.42 Taylor Kruse So in other words, if you work too hard and your heart rate goes up too high, you likely won't be able to to sustain breathing through your nose. And so you'll have to either stop, take a break, or shift to mouth breathing.
00:31:34.07 Taylor Kruse um And so the nasal breathing sets the intensity, which usually it sets it rather moderate to low.
00:31:41.37 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:31:42.17 Taylor Kruse And it's ah it's a really great technique to help mobilize the lymph system. um You have movement, which if we're going to mobilize the lymph system, movement is a big deal, right? Because movement will do it.
00:31:56.54 Taylor Kruse We have breathing. The combination of breathing and movement is really a prerequisite for good mobilization of the lymph system.
00:32:08.34 Taylor Kruse So when we're exercising with cardio, we've we've got both of those things. Breathing through the nose, um and of course your heart rate is elevated as you're doing that.
00:32:21.27 Taylor Kruse The nasal breathing is excellent for building up CO2. And CO2 is one of the um things that helps to basically bring oxygen to our body's tissues.
00:32:40.22 Taylor Kruse So it's, and that and so that's one of the reasons why nasal breathing exercises is so useful for, for generating global circulation. So yeah, it's it's a low-hanging fruit, I'll tell you that, for so many reasons.
00:32:54.25 Tony Fowler Right. Yeah.
00:32:55.26 Taylor Kruse It's a really, really healthy thing to do. And on the topic of lymphatics, it's we we spend a lot of time talking about nasal breathing for increasing fuel capacity.
00:33:08.17 Taylor Kruse And a lot of that time, we don't bring up the lymphatic conversation, but it's it's quite helpful.
00:33:18.04 Taylor Kruse So that was kind of two there. we had We had the CO2 tolerance work, which can be achieved in other ways too. It doesn't have to be cardiovascular exercise. I think all CO2 tolerance work where you are reducing your rate of breathing and maybe even...
00:33:35.59 Taylor Kruse This gets counterintuitive, maybe even not breathing and doing some air hunger exercise where you're you're moving, but you're purposely not breathing.
00:33:40.10 Tony Fowler Right.
00:33:44.03 Taylor Kruse And again, you build up that air hunger, that sensation, that desire to breathe, and that will elevate CO2 levels too. So combining the either reduced breathing where you're breathing slower on purpose, combining that with movement or combining air hunger with movement.
00:34:03.03 Taylor Kruse Those things are great. So like air hunger squats is an exercise we use a lot where you exhale, hold your breath, squat as many times as you can. Then when you have the desire to breathe, you resume breathing, but you do it through your nose and you do it slowly and calmly. And then you repeat bouts of this.
00:34:20.54 Taylor Kruse That would be an air hunger exercise. You could do that with anything. Could be walking, could be running.
00:34:25.84 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:34:26.55 Taylor Kruse And you can also reduce the rate of your breathing. so a little bit more gentle, if you will. Perhaps you are doing what we call box breathing.
00:34:40.38 Taylor Kruse where as you're out for a walk, you inhale for four seconds, hold for four seconds, exhale for four seconds, hold for four seconds, and then resume the same pattern.
00:34:54.52 Taylor Kruse And it doesn't have to be four seconds, but that's usually where we start people. You can increase the number of seconds, and of course, the air hunger becomes more intense. But something like box breathing is a reduced breathing exercise. There's lots of different kinds that you could you could play around with.
00:35:11.43 Taylor Kruse And combining that out you know on your walk right for a few minutes, well, we've got breathing, we've got movement. So we've got mobilization of lymph.
00:35:22.09 Taylor Kruse um And with walking too, it's funny because I get questions quite a bit about...
00:35:22.45 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:35:31.24 Taylor Kruse Buying different things that claim lymphatic drainage. One of the things we mentioned briefly was like the trampoline, or they they call it a rebounder. So, small trampoline usually has a handle on it that you can put your hands on and then you can you can bounce.
00:35:49.62 Taylor Kruse And then the other one that I get asked about is the vibration plate, which is the one probably most popular right now, where you stand or sit on a vibration plate and it literally vibrates pretty aggressively and you get that vibratory stimulus through your whole body head to toe.
00:36:06.46 Tony Fowler these werent These were in a lot of gyms for a while, right? Like the big platform, and you would, like, put one leg on it or two legs on it, and you'd hold on, and would vibrate like crazy.
00:36:17.05 Taylor Kruse I never saw that in a gym, but I'm not a good, I'm really not a good um person to ask about gyms because I haven't even been to a commercial gym in so many years now um that it's like, I don't even know what's in a gym these days, but they're becoming more of a popular product to buy and have in your home.
00:36:19.19 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:36:27.48 Tony Fowler Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:39.19 Tony Fowler Interesting.
00:36:39.58 Taylor Kruse You know, I know that.
00:36:39.79 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:36:40.58 Taylor Kruse And, you know, it's, It's definitely a trend. it's It's certainly a trend right now. you know All the influencers are talking about it. um And you know people ask me, should I get this for my lymph system?
00:36:53.01 Taylor Kruse And like, well, you could. Does it mobilize lymph? Well, yes, but that's because there's movement involved, right? um Well, what about a trampoline?
00:37:07.32 Taylor Kruse Does that mobilize lymph? Well, yes, that's because there's movement involved. Oh, okay. So what would you suggest? Do you want to do it for free?
00:37:19.16 Taylor Kruse Go for a walk. So... It's kind of all built built in by by design, if you know what I mean. And and the interesting thing about walking is that you you get the gastroc activation, so in your calf muscles, and your calf muscles are actually one of the built-in mechanisms that help to drive fluids back up towards the um lymph areas in the inguinal crease, in the hip crease, right?
00:37:51.83 Tony Fowler So when I was complaining about like my calves being sore and it was really weird because I hadn't done any physical activity, I just got sick and just been in bed for three days.
00:38:01.22 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
00:38:03.19 Tony Fowler you immediately were like, hey, consider this lymph stuff. Is that because, like, the calves specifically were cluing you in on that? Or?
00:38:14.65 Taylor Kruse Yeah, well, I immediately thought, well, you you feel soreness without having exercised. So that in itself is usually indicative of some kind of stagnation.
00:38:25.38 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:38:25.62 Taylor Kruse in the body, right? Because you're certain body areas will actually become tender, sore to the touch, or you'll feel it as soreness when the lymph system is, call its you know we're calling it like stagation stagnation, right?
00:38:41.69 Taylor Kruse it's not It's maybe not moving fluids as efficiently, or maybe it is, but it's working hard, right?
00:38:49.66 Tony Fowler You can't keep up maybe, for example.
00:38:50.65 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah, exactly. And so sometimes when we feel
00:38:51.99 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:38:55.22 Taylor Kruse global stiffness or soreness, but we don't have a way to describe why it would be there because of like exercise, sometimes those that's when your lymph system is is working hard, right?
00:39:10.82 Taylor Kruse and And so, you know, with you, when you said, yeah, my calves, it's like, well, yeah, okay, so perhaps perhaps some some lymph work would be good there. I mean, it could be as simple as making sure you get outside, get sunlight, get walking in, walking, combination, movement, and breathing.
00:39:24.99 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:39:27.26 Taylor Kruse right it's not It doesn't have to be complicated. Your lymph system works by design. I guess I should say, until it doesn't.
00:39:39.77 Taylor Kruse And there's actually, you know, because you can have more significant blockage for very specific health-related reasons.
00:39:39.89 Tony Fowler Right.
00:39:53.35 Tony Fowler Right.
00:39:53.85 Taylor Kruse you know? So different from like you when you have a cold, when you had a cold or like I have a cold right now, and I do have a little tenderness in my body, even though last time I exercised was two days ago. I didn't really do too much because I was still not quite back, and I am a little bit sore, probably more so than I should be.
00:40:14.71 Taylor Kruse And, you know, that's kind of that acute response, you know, that that maybe we can we can counter with the right movement in breathing.
00:40:27.80 Taylor Kruse Pretty easy, right?
00:40:29.62 Tony Fowler So okay i was going to just mention, you know, all of this reminds me of the same stuff you might do when you're in like recovery mode from heavy training.
00:40:42.04 Taylor Kruse Yeah, it can be ah it can be a useful recovery tool. Usually with recovery, I'm typically not i'm not leaning on this that much and unless I think my the athlete I'm working with has a recovery problem, or the person that I'm working with has a recovery problem, and some people do, right?
00:40:56.38 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:41:00.86 Tony Fowler who
00:41:01.24 Taylor Kruse And so you can you can lean on lymphatic techniques to help to help recover.
00:41:06.14 Tony Fowler Or even just going for a walk or, you know what I mean? Like, I feel like a circulation is good when you have doms and that kind of thing. Right. It's like helpful to kind of flesh that out.
00:41:15.26 Taylor Kruse Yes.
00:41:18.34 Tony Fowler Um,
00:41:18.36 Taylor Kruse Yes. and And I should say, kind of going back to this idea where you can have like an acute situation, like having a cold or something, and then you can have something that becomes more chronic, stagnation that presents itself because of an injury of some kind, so or even the state of the nervous system.
00:41:39.64 Taylor Kruse So couple of interesting ideas. you could You could have stagnation in the limb system because of a past injury or surgery. so And in location is very important here because of where these nodes are and the direction that fluids are flowing.
00:42:02.33 Taylor Kruse All of that can be thrown off. Pressure can be thrown off. um Blood flow to certain areas of the body can be thrown off by injury and past surgery. And I'll give you a pretty relatable one, relatable for a lot of women, would be having had a C-section.
00:42:22.78 Taylor Kruse right That is an insult to the skin and underlying tissues in the middle of the body. And if you've had multiple C-sections, which is becoming quite common,
00:42:35.61 Taylor Kruse Basically, you could develop um you know vascular type issues in that area, where you know blood flow issues in that area, and where you get sliced, basically, is very close to several different lymph node areas.
00:42:55.77 Taylor Kruse So it's it's quite close to the ones we mentioned in the inguinal creases.
00:43:01.45 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:43:02.42 Taylor Kruse There's also a deep a deeper lymphatic area in the in the abdomen. um I don't know if I'm going to pronounce it right, so don't quote me, but cisterna cisterna kylie, I think, is the is the lymph area in the abdomen, which is deeper than what we were talking about with, say, the cervical nodes or the inguinal ones.
00:43:19.29 Tony Fowler okay
00:43:31.32 Taylor Kruse But the point
00:43:31.38 Tony Fowler So maybe harder to to get to from the manual massage, right?
00:43:36.12 Taylor Kruse Harder to get to, but you can do it.
00:43:37.66 Tony Fowler okay
00:43:37.88 Taylor Kruse You can do it And that's the thing about the lymph system is it's responsive to all the dermal layer stuff. Yeah, it's for sure. So that's what makes it unique and quite easy to work with.
00:43:50.55 Taylor Kruse But something like a C-section scar or any kind of abdominal scar in that area can throw off fluid dynamics in how fluids are moving because scar tissue can restrict blood flow, basically.
00:44:07.99 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:44:07.99 Taylor Kruse um And, you know, you can you can develop movement issues over time, whether it's, you know, through deakin being deconditioned or having had a some sort of injury or scar and your connective tissues and and scar tissue is forming and you you know you have fascial winding that takes place over a longer period of time when your body is compensating in a certain way. All of that eventually can cause or at least be part of these different blood flow issues that people might encounter. So again, the location matters.
00:44:47.19 Taylor Kruse you know if you've there's There's other lymph node areas that are susceptible to scarring, would be up like around the armpit.
00:44:57.94 Taylor Kruse So up basically in your armpit, kind of underneath, like if you were to dig around underneath like the around the pec minor area, um people sometimes when they get sick actually can feel in their armpit that they have some swelling or tenderness.
00:45:11.83 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:45:14.62 Taylor Kruse That area is quite susceptible when there's been some kind of injury in the chest area or around the clavicles. so there's yeah So there can be location you know reasons and injury reasons that create stagnation.
00:45:35.22 Taylor Kruse And the more systemic one that i was that I was referring to with the nervous system is one I think about a lot, more than what I just described, actually, because it has to do more with sympathetics.
00:45:47.96 Taylor Kruse So an easy way to describe this is somebody that is going through a lot of sympathetic arousal all the time, right? We know that we don't want that.
00:46:02.17 Taylor Kruse right you don't want You don't want elevated sympathetics all the time because that's no fun. That that means you are essentially a walking fight or flight nervous system.
00:46:13.98 Taylor Kruse So your nervous system is, if you're kind of stuck in fight or flight, your nervous system is producing survival-based behaviors and responses constantly.
00:46:24.98 Taylor Kruse You don't want that, right? We want to be able to shift out of that when it's appropriate, meal time, digesting, sleeping, relaxing, enjoying an activity, friends, loved ones, whatever it is.
00:46:39.64 Taylor Kruse You want the state, your state, to be able to downregulate, have a little bit more balance with your parasympathetics, right? So that you're not it stuck in that fight or flight.
00:46:52.79 Taylor Kruse And the idea of getting stuck in fight or flight can happen for lots of different reasons. It can be injury, certain you know types of trauma.
00:47:05.21 Taylor Kruse It can be upbringing. It can be all sorts of things, right?
00:47:10.80 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:47:11.32 Taylor Kruse um Your behavior over time, stressful factors, environmental factors, dysfunctional breathing patterns for years.
00:47:23.03 Taylor Kruse right? I mean, so many different things, right? Nutritional deficits, right? Can drive it. And Here's the key takeaway. When you're kind of under the dominance of fight or flight all the time, or your sympathetics are elevated, your sympathetics, um or I should say your high sympathetic tone equals vasoconstriction of the lymphatic vessels.
00:47:54.62 Taylor Kruse Okay, so in other words, the constriction of the vessels that are involved in moving lymph.
00:48:04.73 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:48:05.59 Taylor Kruse And so, and that's if you think about that, if you yourself or you know somebody that is very elevated with their sympathetics, Those same people usually describe having like global chronic tension, tension in the neck, tension in the shoulders, tension in the jaw, tension under their arms, maybe be tension in their hips. Usually they're talking about bilateral tension, so it's not like and like a one-sided thing usually.
00:48:36.63 Taylor Kruse and It's usually bilateral. And they they run tight a lot of the times. Not all the time, but most of these people run tight. They're a little bit more, they have they present with what we would just say is tighter tissue, basically. and in And that tight tissue, from having elevated sympathetics, because with elevated sympathetics, we see an increase in tension in the body by design, right?
00:49:02.68 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:49:03.73 Taylor Kruse That's how it works. um that tight tissue makes it so that those body tissues do not receive blood flow as efficiently, chronically over time, is what I'm talking about, chronically over time. So this is taking place over a long period of time.
00:49:24.44 Taylor Kruse If you are very sympathetic, you you typically run into blood flow issues, which causes more tightness right It makes muscles feel more tight you know much more tighter. and So anyways, the point being, it's the constriction part. right Sympathetics become elevated for a long time under the dominance of fight or flight. We see the vasoconstriction on the lymph vessels, and that in itself can lead to somebody who does not have a lymphatic system that operates, let's just say, optimally for them.
00:50:03.70 Tony Fowler So parasympathetic activation may be helpful at kind of a global level to just help with.
00:50:11.86 Taylor Kruse Yes. great it's a great yeah It's a great comment.
00:50:13.91 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:50:14.22 Taylor Kruse um Like vagal type things, vagal type drills, parasympathetic kinds of drills actually are a very nice addition to any of the lymphatic work that a person might do.
00:50:26.85 Tony Fowler Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
00:50:27.19 Taylor Kruse Yeah, that can be that can be useful. yeah Activating the vagus nerve, which is highly involved in your immune function as well yeah so it's a it's a good it's a good thing to add so i'm looking at my my bullets here where we were talking about techniques and we had talked about the co2 tolerance the cardiovascular exercise oh you seem to be okay on my end
00:50:45.62 Tony Fowler You are frozen for me.
00:50:57.47 Taylor Kruse my back
00:52:56.18 Taylor Kruse Yo, that was weird.
00:52:56.92 Tony Fowler There he is.
00:52:58.02 Taylor Kruse at Even getting on was like slower, but I don't know. My internet's fine.
00:53:03.65 Taylor Kruse Signal's fine.
00:53:04.74 Tony Fowler me check mine real quick. It looks fine also, but yeah, I'm super fast.
00:53:17.40 Tony Fowler OK. Well, we shouldn't have lost anything, but yeah, if you yeah if you don't mind just jumping back in.
00:53:19.55 Taylor Kruse I know where was Yeah. me yeah
00:53:27.00 Tony Fowler Thank you.
00:53:30.71 Taylor Kruse All right, so looking at my list here of bullets of different techniques that you know, we can very practically easily use for for the lymph system. Here's another interesting interesting one to consider. And it's it's cool because we talk a lot about joint mobility.
00:53:49.40 Taylor Kruse But we talk about joint mobility in the sense of, you know, training proprioception, using it as a tool to train the cerebellum, things like that.
00:54:00.39 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:54:01.50 Taylor Kruse We have not yet talked about joint mobility as a tool for thinking about mobilizing the lymphatic system. So this is kind of a a neat one because, again, it's movement, right? And if we know where to move, we can affect the lymph system in a more productive way.
00:54:21.43 Taylor Kruse In fact, there's even an order that tends to, kind of an order of operations that tends to be the most powerful in terms of promoting more movement of fluids.
00:54:34.01 Taylor Kruse So and we can kind of quickly go through that order. So we've got um a place to, like a starting place with lymph mobilization if you're going to do any kind of tactile work or as I'm about to describe, joint mobility work.
00:54:50.49 Taylor Kruse You would start up around just above the collarbones. okay So that's kind of site number one.
00:54:58.28 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:54:58.68 Taylor Kruse And then from there, after doing some work above the clavicle, you would move up to the cervical region, but up near the corner of the jaw and a little bit back towards almost like the earlobes.
00:55:14.26 Taylor Kruse That would be kind of the the zone. that be site number two. And then the third site would be around the shoulder region. kind of like anterior shoulder, okay?
00:55:28.95 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:55:30.21 Taylor Kruse And into the armpit, basically, would be would be the the next areas. And then from there... the abdomen.
00:55:41.69 Taylor Kruse So, we'd be a we'd be above the navel, basically. So, if you find your navel and then you go, you know, kind of three, four finger widths above the navel, that's a good area.
00:55:56.50 Taylor Kruse um Typically, the work we do there is a little bit deeper than the dermal, but still dermal is effective there too.
00:55:59.99 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:56:04.22 Taylor Kruse And then we would go from there to the inguinal creases, which is the hip area that we had already already described. And then finally, the backs of the knees.
00:56:15.03 Taylor Kruse the The back of the knee actually has some some lymph nodes there that are pretty much, you can palpate them, um maybe not quite as easy to find as the ones in the in the hips. But you can, so you would you would approach,
00:56:32.18 Taylor Kruse your self-lymphatic work in that order with better success based on how fluid dynamics work in the direction of fluid flow.
00:56:47.16 Taylor Kruse So that could mean a number of different things. On the joint mobility end of things, I will sometimes create a little joint mobility routine for people that need better lymphatic flow.
00:57:00.15 Taylor Kruse So that would start up at the clavicles with like shoulder camshafts. We've got a mobility drill that is all about moving the scapula
00:57:10.81 Tony Fowler Okay.
00:57:10.81 Taylor Kruse but it's close enough, you're goingnna get you're gonna get movement up in the region of like the clavicle.
00:57:10.98 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:57:18.04 Taylor Kruse And so you might start there with some motor control work for the scaps. Then you go up to the neck and the jaw, and we've got different mobility drills that we do there, hold so a whole series of cervical mobility drills, even the jaw um mobility drills where you're moving your jaw in different directions, gliding it side to side, forward, backwards, circles, all this stuff.
00:57:39.57 Taylor Kruse And from there, we would move to more of like the anterior shoulder area. So we might be doing some like shoulder circle work there. And then we move down to the abdomen where maybe now we're doing some diaphragm mobilizations. I know that...
00:57:55.26 Taylor Kruse our students that listen to this are going to know exactly what I'm talking about. Like people who take our courses are like, we talk about this stuff so much and it becomes so systematic in our thought process.
00:57:59.16 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:58:06.66 Taylor Kruse Like they're checking this off as they go. Um, I don't expect our, our listeners that have not been with us as long in the podcast or have taken the courses might be like, what the heck's a shoulder camshaft?
00:58:17.73 Taylor Kruse What's a diaphragm stretch? You can find all this stuff on our YouTube channel. Um, the diaphragm stretch is a breathing drill. that is good for mobilizing the diaphragm.
00:58:29.62 Taylor Kruse And it is the diaphragm is another structure we could could you know talk about here for being you know involved in in lymph, right? Because it's the main muscle for breathing.
00:58:45.35 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:58:45.53 Taylor Kruse So mobilizing the diaphragm is going to help people breathe better, but also mobilizing the connective tissues near that area, that zone above the navel can be quite good.
00:58:57.72 Taylor Kruse We might do some lumbar mobility for that too. We've got a whole series of lumbar mobility drills, front circles, back circles, lateral glides. Same idea with the hips, moving down to the hips. We've got a whole series of hip mobility drills, and then we've got ah several different knee mobility drills that we like. So you get the idea.
00:59:17.56 Tony Fowler Yeah.
00:59:17.69 Taylor Kruse You can use isolated joint mobility like we we love to use for other reasons, but you can put it together.
00:59:17.72 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
00:59:25.05 Taylor Kruse in a routine and going through it in this order is is really useful. That can be good and you can even combine that with sensory stimulus at those same sites.
00:59:38.55 Taylor Kruse So if you have like a little vibration tool or a percussion tool, Those things can be quite useful. Again, starting up above the clavicles, maybe 20 seconds of stimulus in each of the zones on each side of the body, following up with movement.
00:59:55.72 Taylor Kruse That's a good way to go.
00:59:57.98 Tony Fowler So when you you sent me those ah that lymph kind of technique, the guy followed that that order um two to a T.
01:00:03.70 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:00:07.68 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:00:09.04 Tony Fowler And basically all it was was just kind of padding those areas and then moving on to the next one.
01:00:13.46 Taylor Kruse Yep, you don't even need a tool.
01:00:15.74 Tony Fowler And so I guess – yeah, yeah.
01:00:16.15 Taylor Kruse Make your own percussion.
01:00:19.13 Tony Fowler And so I guess I'm curious, like –
01:00:22.97 Tony Fowler you You mentioned doing more like mobility exercises.
01:00:26.76 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
01:00:26.87 Tony Fowler Is that because we're increasing circulation and and and movement? Like, is it more effective than just like, you know, doing that manual percussion padding or.
01:00:36.18 Taylor Kruse The padding. the the yeah So my answer is I just don't know.
01:00:41.50 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:00:41.50 Taylor Kruse i I've tried to figure this out over the years. What's better?
01:00:45.26 Tony Fowler Hmm.
01:00:45.30 Taylor Kruse Is it the movement? Is it the sensory? Is it both? It seems to have some very individualized components to it. And so it's following the theory, we technically want both.
01:01:01.70 Taylor Kruse I think both combined in the same routine can be good. Just like we said, movement plus breathing, you know, doing some breathing work like those diaphragm stretches, like CO2 tolerance work in combination with the joint mobility or in combination with the sensory work.
01:01:06.88 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:01:17.98 Taylor Kruse it's It's effective. which Which is better? I don't know. and in And it's very positional, like positionally specific for different individuals. Like for me,
01:01:28.89 Taylor Kruse I do exceptionally well working up by the thoracic ducts, which are the ducts we're interested in near the clavicle.
01:01:37.99 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
01:01:38.33 Taylor Kruse And I do really, really well with the cervical ones. As far as the other zone, other locations, I don't notice as much, right?
01:01:49.05 Taylor Kruse And so it just, ah it depends, I think, on the individual for sure.
01:01:54.14 Tony Fowler Yeah, that makes sense.
01:01:54.88 Taylor Kruse Yep. Mm-hmm.
01:01:56.06 Tony Fowler um Much like our neuro techniques, it's very specific, right?
01:01:56.38 Taylor Kruse Mm-hmm.
01:01:58.71 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:02:00.06 Tony Fowler Very context specific. Can can I ask you real quick, when you say I notice it helps, it works here more than there, what are you noticing?
01:02:02.23 Taylor Kruse For sure. Yeah.
01:02:10.15 Taylor Kruse OK, so it's a good point. When I'm doing lymph work, I have a goal, a very specific goal. So for example, the last time that I was doing lymph work was because of pain.
01:02:21.98 Taylor Kruse Okay, so this is a good time to tell ah a quick story. Last summer, those who been listening know that I had really bad symptoms on the left side of my body running down my leg.
01:02:34.30 Tony Fowler Thank you.
01:02:35.42 Taylor Kruse and it was, I just describe it as kind of sciatic in nature. It wasn't truly a sciatic, um it wasn't truly down that distribution, but anyways, the whole left side of my, outside of my leg, had i had a lot of nervy sensation, a lot of burning, tingling, lots of pain, and it was a different type of pain than then most people experience. So like,
01:03:04.02 Taylor Kruse I was not able to replicate it with a specific movement.
01:03:08.42 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:03:08.76 Taylor Kruse So it wasn't like, hey, watch what happens when I abduct my hip and you know abduct and flex it, oh, ouch, there's the pinch. It wasn't that type of pain. It wasn't position-specific like that.
01:03:20.95 Taylor Kruse It was more like, oh my gosh, this sucks all the time, and I can't pinpoint it. I can't just take my finger and go right there. like Yes, I can. It hurts right there, but it also is causing me all this radiating discomfort all over my leg.
01:03:41.98 Taylor Kruse right and So was kind of a different kind of pain presentation. And a long story short, if you've heard the story that I talked about at one point in the podcast, it was not an injury event pain. It was really, really significant pain that even kept me from walking at times.
01:03:59.61 Taylor Kruse And it was all related to an inflammatory response that my body was having because of mold toxicity, And the mold toxicity over time, because this is something that we were dealing with for several years, had caused me to have gut issues.
01:04:19.13 Taylor Kruse um I developed a mild gluten sensitivity. I developed developed an infection in my gut, as well as just kind of overall digestive you know disturbance, sensitivities that I didn't have before, including leaky gut.
01:04:37.34 Taylor Kruse so this manifested itself and presented itself as this nasty pain down my left leg. So nothing was working. I explained the story.
01:04:49.40 Taylor Kruse you know I think think in our January episode, my neuro tools weren't hacking it. That's very rare. And so when that happens, it's like, oh boy, what what health like what health problem is this?
01:05:00.44 Taylor Kruse Because usually we can at least find a result relatively fast.
01:05:01.14 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:05:03.72 Taylor Kruse My nerve glides weren't working, even though it felt like I needed them, like I had nerve irritation. And um as I started to make progress on my gut health, that's when I was able to start you know fixing the pain.
01:05:18.62 Taylor Kruse But the tool that I ended up using that was giving me at least temporary relief so that I could go on with my day was lymphatics. Because my day would start and I'd roll out of bed and I'd be trashed right away.
01:05:34.26 Taylor Kruse And i would go downstairs and before I did anything, I would lay on my gym floor with my feet elevated on my bench. And I would take a kettlebell, kind of a kind of a light kettlebell, I think it was like maybe 15, 20 pounds.
01:05:54.23 Taylor Kruse and I would place it on the thoracic ducks or the thoracic duct on my yeah on my left side okay um Meaning, I took the kettlebell and I put it on my, it's like just below my clavicle on my left pec, but I sort of would like wiggle the kettlebell around until it sort of found a home resting in the groove between what would be my pec, clavicle, and anterior deltoid.
01:06:30.62 Tony Fowler Yeah, there's like a little, yep, there's a little dip there.
01:06:30.88 Taylor Kruse It was kind of like a depression. Yeah, and that pressure feels good when you find it. So the kettlebell would be pressing into that area and kind of like also falling off my body, so like tractioning the skin away from my midline. And I would hold it with my hand to make sure that it didn't actually fall off, but it was this pressure plus traction on my left side.
01:06:56.22 Taylor Kruse And while that pressure was there... I would also do some breathing work. So I did some diaphragm stretches. And then I would also, I have a handheld vibration device that I would work on the lymph area, the the lymph node area on my neck.
01:07:17.78 Taylor Kruse So like right under the corner of the jaw.
01:07:18.18 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:07:20.63 Taylor Kruse So I would do this all at once, kind of just going back and forth. um And this was a way to mobilize lymph throughout the body.
01:07:32.34 Taylor Kruse And it really helped me a lot. I would immediately get up and I would be able to walk. and I'd be able to go about my day. My pain would drastically reduce, so you know it'd be like a go from like a chronic seven or an eight down to a one, and I'd be able to, you know I'd get this result for several hours until things kind of came back to what they were before, and then at some point I would also do that routine in the afternoon.
01:08:03.16 Taylor Kruse but It was super helpful. Very, very helpful. did not It did not fix what was the underlying root cause of the problem, but it was just one of those times where I was leaning on that tool to provide me enough result to just get some relief and feel better.
01:08:12.66 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:08:21.11 Taylor Kruse And it was it was quite useful. And so I should describe... kettlebell on the chest a little bit because the the side matters. So one of the things our listeners can do is look up one of the lymphatic drainage maps and you'll see an image of the body that is essentially sliced down the middle.
01:08:42.68 Taylor Kruse And what you'll see is that usually these images will show what is the right and left thoracic ducts. okay And this this is where all fluid eventually re-enters circulation through these ducts up at the clavicles, which is why it's such an important area in our in our lymph techniques.
01:09:07.45 Taylor Kruse And so by putting the kettlebell on the left side, if you were to look at one of the images, you'll see that the left thoracic duct is responsible for drainage for most of the body.
01:09:23.42 Taylor Kruse So whole left side of the body, head to toe, also the right leg. And then um the right side, the right thoracic duct is responsible for, um it's a smaller duct. And so it's responsible for the right arm, the right side of the thorax, and even the right side of the face and neck.
01:09:50.46 Taylor Kruse So this is very important to know because if you're going to use one of like a technique like I described with pressure on the clavicle, you have to have a goal. And so for me, my goal was pain relief on the left side of my body.
01:10:06.58 Taylor Kruse So therefore, I'm not going to go and put the kettlebell on the right duct. I'm going to put it on the left. um But let's say I had a goal of pain relief on my right leg.
01:10:17.59 Taylor Kruse Well, I would still put the kettlebell on the left duct because of the way this is organized with most of the body draining to the left the left thoracic duct. So knowing that is quite interesting. If you had an injury to the right side of your face,
01:10:37.21 Taylor Kruse right where you had visible swelling or something on the right side of your face, and your goal was to deal with the right side of the face. Or maybe you had fluid in your ear on the right side, and you wanted to promote movement of fluid in the ear canal.
01:10:44.36 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
01:10:51.96 Taylor Kruse um You were feeling you know you had fluid there. Well, then you would be doing your techniques on the right side um for the right the right duct. right So that's an important piece to know. and you know The pressure on the ducts, that area seems to work pretty well. that can be done by a That can be done manually. Someone can press on it for you.
01:11:12.89 Taylor Kruse um But the cool thing is it's pretty pretty accessible. I just take the kettlebell and usually put it it wrap it in like a towel.
01:11:21.74 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:11:21.97 Taylor Kruse and then use the use that as the pressure. You can also use sandbags, which is great, i just don't have any. But if you had a sandbag that was heavy enough, that would be nice. You wouldn't even have to...
01:11:30.75 Tony Fowler I'm shocked you don't have sandbags. That seems like a real tailor tool.
01:11:32.54 Taylor Kruse Me too. i Yeah. Yeah, I will eventually. i'd like to get I'd like to get some heavy sandbags, maybe one of those, you know, like the med balls that are heavy.
01:11:43.87 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:11:44.34 Taylor Kruse You know, I'd like to throw those things around outside. and
01:11:47.16 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:11:47.86 Taylor Kruse Yeah, right now I'm sort of maxed out on space for my home gym, you know.
01:11:51.04 Tony Fowler Sure.
01:11:53.21 Taylor Kruse But once we...
01:11:53.72 Tony Fowler I get it, dude. that's I think that's the main pain of of building a home gym is what can you fit?
01:11:54.78 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:11:58.10 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah. Eventually when when we find our next our next place will be a home that we'll buy and that'll be, you know, I'll be thinking about some stuff like that for sure.
01:12:07.85 Tony Fowler Oh man, I'm excited for that.
01:12:09.53 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:12:09.59 Tony Fowler um so So back to back to lymphatics, um you also mentioned something to me at the time.
01:12:14.01 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:12:17.33 Tony Fowler You were like, you know, sometimes you'll feel lousy first before you feel better when you do these mobilization techniques.
01:12:21.24 Taylor Kruse Oh, yeah. Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up. Mm-hmm.
01:12:24.90 Tony Fowler What's up with that?
01:12:26.07 Taylor Kruse you know that So it is possible when you start to do lymphatic work to have like an acute um response where the body is responding to what is essentially detox.
01:12:40.62 Taylor Kruse It's becoming maybe a little overwhelmed, and sometimes we have negative symptoms like that. It's kind of like, for me... when i made when I made changes to my diet and then I was taking a lot of supplements that were sort of encouraging my body to do more detox, I actually felt lousy at times as my body was going through that process. That same idea can happen sometimes with lymphatic work.
01:13:03.71 Taylor Kruse It's... It's not all the time, and I wouldn't even call it that common. you know usually Usually the body can handle it, but if you're somebody that's been in a sympathetic state for a very long time, maybe you have other metabolic you know the concerns that you're working through, and you start all of a sudden pressing the right button to get your lymph system to mobilize more, then you absolutely could feel lousy. It's usually pretty short-lived,
01:13:32.92 Taylor Kruse You know, it's it's pretty short-lived, and then it typically, the more you you get a good response, and the body kind of adapts, and then it's gone. You don't you don't feel it. But you could even get a skin rash.
01:13:48.09 Taylor Kruse You know, stuff like that can happen.
01:13:49.88 Tony Fowler Interesting.
01:13:50.04 Taylor Kruse Headache, dizziness, skin rash, nausea, stuff like that.
01:13:51.13 Tony Fowler Interesting.
01:13:55.67 Tony Fowler So this is sort of the opposite of a lot of our neuro neuro tools where you kind of encourage us to follow how we feel.
01:14:04.47 Taylor Kruse m
01:14:04.70 Tony Fowler Like if we feel better, that's that's usually a good sign.
01:14:07.18 Taylor Kruse Yep.
01:14:07.89 Tony Fowler If we feel worse, that's usually a bad sign. Like listen to that. This is that that sort of counterintuitive exception to that rule, it seems.
01:14:14.68 Taylor Kruse Yeah. Yeah, it's it's it's something good to know about because it is possible.
01:14:19.60 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:14:19.74 Taylor Kruse and And yeah, technically when you're when you're having that response, yeah, you just kind of kind of go, oh, okay, that's that's the response. i I get why it's happening.
01:14:30.46 Taylor Kruse And it doesn't it's not necessarily a bad thing. But I will say this, it also brings up a good point. You can assess and reassess your response and even the location of the lymph work that you're doing the same way we would with the other neuro work.
01:14:47.51 Taylor Kruse So testing range of motion is actually a really useful tool. Remember that global stagnation of the lymph system generally causes feelings of tightness and can restrict range of motion.
01:15:00.38 Taylor Kruse So when you start doing lymphatic work, like for me, pressing on the left side duct, right, and spending some time there with vibration on you know my neck and doing some diaphragm stretches, I would stand up and I would retest and I would find, oh, my rotation's better, my hips feel looser, my pain has decreased.
01:15:23.89 Taylor Kruse I'm doing good with this technique. I'm being accurate and and my body is responding positively to it.
01:15:27.34 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:15:30.03 Taylor Kruse and You can do the same thing with you know if you're using percussion or vibration at those different lymphatic node areas, you might find that working on one area, if you're testing range of motion as you apply the stimulus, you might find one is more productive for you than another.
01:15:49.24 Taylor Kruse um So that's, you know, it's it's worth assessing how your body's responding. I will tell you that like the direct dermal level work around lymph nodes can actually be very precise. So...
01:16:02.74 Taylor Kruse You know, it's it's kind of like, there's kind of two ways to approach it. There's sort of the throw all the darts at the dartboard, hope something sticks, which is perfectly fine because a lot of the time you're going to get a reasonable result.
01:16:10.40 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:16:16.65 Taylor Kruse But sometimes to be more specific and you can actually pressure check these areas in your lymph nodes where... You take your fingers, you you press in not super hard, we're still dermal level, but you can actually drag the skin in eight different directions of the compass and you can test which one seems to give you the best result in terms of range of motion.
01:16:42.95 Tony Fowler hmm.
01:16:43.29 Taylor Kruse And so if you drag the skin in a certain direction and you're holding that pressure and you notice, oh, my jaw feels looser, my neck feels looser, oh, that's weird. All of a sudden I'm breathing a little better, like my sinuses opened up.
01:16:57.24 Taylor Kruse Well, you just found a very position-specific thing that's going to help you do better work at that zone. So people with manual therapy skills, you know they can approach it in a much more targeted way.
01:17:13.01 Tony Fowler That's so interesting because it's like we've talked about this, but not at the lymph node areas.
01:17:19.51 Taylor Kruse Oh, exactly. It's the same thing I talk about with um yep same thing i talk about with scars.
01:17:20.44 Tony Fowler And so, yeah.
01:17:25.79 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:17:26.26 Taylor Kruse right I mean, you don't need a scar for this technique to be useful. Sometimes we do it for other reasons, too. You can pressure check. nerves, right, you can pressure check any area of the skin that you want, scar or not, but it's it's very effective for finding the right directional, kind of finding the the directionality of a scar, essentially the direction your nervous system likes the most.
01:17:54.79 Tony Fowler Mm-hmm.
01:17:55.03 Taylor Kruse and and also doesn't like, which is very useful at times, figuring out that, hey, don't drag the skin in that direction because that is perceived as threatening for some reason, which it brings a whole nother level of accuracy and precision to the manual work that we do.
01:18:14.23 Taylor Kruse and it And it's why you can't actually trust a general approach with manual therapy when you have a specific problem. You can't just move the tissue in all the directions possible. It's not that simple, and the nervous system doesn't necessarily accept it.
01:18:32.12 Taylor Kruse And so testing that's why testing is so important when you're trying to get more thorough.
01:18:37.82 Tony Fowler This may be also be a ah good a reason to tell someone not to buy an expensive ah vibration mat, because maybe that's a good thing.
01:18:45.27 Taylor Kruse Yep.
01:18:47.17 Tony Fowler Generally, I'm just thinking like everything in your body is kind of vibrating and moving. um But that lack of precision could also work against you, right? Like parts of your body might not like that frequency of vibration or that intensity of vibration.
01:19:00.22 Taylor Kruse Totally. I mean, this is this is the whole thing. like People ask me about these vibration plates all the time. it's a This is how it works with marketing, and this is how it works with products. you See, humans are suckers for intrinsic motivation.
01:19:14.65 Taylor Kruse So the more you feel something, the more you think it's doing. that's how That's how we think. okay And so something like a vibration plate is very intense. You're going feel the stimulus through your whole body, and it makes you think, oh, this must be doing more because I feel it more. It doesn't always work that way. And then, of course, there's always a dosage concern, too.
01:19:36.92 Taylor Kruse So don't get me wrong. I'm not saying people are going to go out there and start getting hurt from vibration plates, but... It's just not accurate work, right? and And so if you're looking for that global stimulus and you test it and you feel good from it, by all means, have at it.
01:19:53.40 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:19:53.59 Taylor Kruse There could be value there for threat reduction, for sure. um But for targeted work, we have to get more targeted. We have to test and respect what the nervous system is showing us.
01:20:06.68 Taylor Kruse So yeah, I don't i don't think you don't have to go out and buy an expensive vibration plate to get started on mobilizing your lymph system. Remember, that the the most important things, you have to combine breathing with movement.
01:20:23.00 Taylor Kruse That is step number one. If you want to get more targeted, you combine breathing with movement of the right body areas in the right order. And you can then add the sensory part to that too, where you're also applying the vibration or the percussion or whatever it is that you like to those same areas. And that's you know depending on your goals, if if you have side of the body goals, right-sided versus left-sided, I just told you the key factor there.
01:20:54.78 Taylor Kruse as far as beginning with the thoracic ducts, left thoracic duct for most of the body, right thoracic duct for right side of the thorax, right side of the face, neck, and right arm.
01:20:58.82 Tony Fowler Yeah. Yeah.
01:21:07.83 Taylor Kruse So I'll be honest with you. You don't need to know much more than that. And there's so much there um that as far as I'm concerned and the type of work that I do with people, i usually don't need to even think beyond that.
01:21:25.31 Tony Fowler Well, that's super fascinating. I do feel like ah you were saying it's it's becoming popular. I haven't seen that. This is all like new new territory for me.
01:21:34.01 Taylor Kruse Interesting.
01:21:35.61 Tony Fowler So super fascinating stuff.
01:21:36.64 Taylor Kruse Isn't that funny? when When I say something's becoming popular, it's it's literally because of that stupid algorithm tricking me into thinking that everybody's seeing the same stuff that I am.
01:21:37.60 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:21:44.09 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:21:47.70 Tony Fowler but But certain people are, right?
01:21:49.40 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah, certain people are.
01:21:49.46 Tony Fowler Certain people that follow the same things you do. Yeah, but yeah, we're all we're all in silos.
01:21:53.00 Taylor Kruse Yeah.
01:21:54.85 Tony Fowler Eventually, we're all going to be in different realities, perfectly suited to our own interests.
01:21:55.22 Taylor Kruse I know.
01:21:58.88 Taylor Kruse I know.
01:22:01.97 Taylor Kruse Man, it goes to show you how i think about this sometimes. It's like how scary if you're spending a lot of time on social media, like how your life is or your day and your life is being built around what you're being seen in a very controlled environment.
01:22:21.34 Taylor Kruse You know, it's crazy.
01:22:23.29 Tony Fowler Yeah, it's ah it's it's really worthwhile sometimes to sit down with people and just like talk about the topics. Like, what are you hearing about?
01:22:32.89 Taylor Kruse who
01:22:33.08 Tony Fowler Because you'd be shocked how different people, the emphasis is on different news stories or whether they're even being talked about at all in different circles.
01:22:38.81 Taylor Kruse Yeah, yeah.
01:22:42.01 Taylor Kruse Right.
01:22:43.04 Tony Fowler And it's like, man, we got to figure that out. But that's that's a topic for a different podcast, I think.
01:22:47.22 Taylor Kruse I know. Yeah, yeah.
01:22:50.45 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:22:53.69 Tony Fowler Nice. Any final thoughts?
01:22:56.54 Taylor Kruse No, I think we got it, man. That was, yeah, I'm i'm glad we circled back and finally got this one in.
01:22:58.45 Tony Fowler Yeah.
01:23:04.73 Taylor Kruse So I hope hope everybody enjoyed it. I hope that you learned something about the lymphatic system and that you can try some of the tactics that we described.
01:23:16.66 Taylor Kruse um if If you want to learn more about the nervous system, and those fundamental concepts that we're always coming back to. Remember that you can still watch the replay of my free Neuro Masterclass. So really nice compliment to the podcast, especially if you've been starting to listen more to the episodes. It gets pretty complex here, right? We're going into a lot of, you know, really interesting topics and going quite deep.
01:23:46.66 Taylor Kruse It's very complimentary to watch the free masterclass because you will get the fundamental educational concepts that are so important, like the threat bucket, like neuro 101, where does voluntary movement come from? And then you'll get a real time experience where you actually get to try some neuro drills and assess and reassess and see how your body responds, which is really the key to all of this is learning how to listen to your body. So make sure that you hit up the show notes. You'll find a link and you can still watch the the free replay.
01:24:21.18 Taylor Kruse So thank you guys so much for listening and for your support on the podcast. We'll be back soon.
